Summer survival - what not to wear?^

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Mark R
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Summer survival - what not to wear?^

Post by Mark R » Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:36 pm

Thinking ahead to my big summer trip.

One thing I've never quite figured out is what to wear in the summer - I have all manner of kit to survive nasty conditions in winter, but in summer I just paddle in an open-necked cag and shorts (or less), even on exposed solo paddles. Any more clothes and I 'boil in the bag' and dehydrate.

Obviously a pair of shorts isn't entirely adequate for surviving an unintended immersion. Any better suggestions?
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What to wear

Post by av.surfer » Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:46 pm

You could try some neoprene shorts Lomo do some pre bent jobbies for under £20. Bargin!!
Or i'm sure Reed will have some aquatherm shorts to suit.
Matt

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Post by Douglas Wilcox » Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:56 pm

I have found the Fourth Element thermocline gear to be very good. It is made of polartec Aquashell which stretches 4 ways, is breathable, waterproof (to rain, it does not have sealed wrist and neck) and windproof. It is lined with microfleece and if you fall in to cold water it is as warm as 2.5mm neoprene.

I wear it year round: on its own, under a cag and in winter under a dry suit.

http://www.fourthelement.com/thermocline_explorer.php

http://www.fourthelement.com/thermocline_core.php

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Post by Owen » Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:58 pm

I like Fourth Elements shorts, not quite so Betty Swollocks as neoprene, and at £45 only a bit more expensive.

I have a short sleaved top as well, which is good as you don't need to wear a cag so often but their black so absorb UV.

Douglas beat me to it.

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Post by Cornholio » Sun Feb 24, 2008 7:29 pm

That 4th Element stuff looks the biz for summer, after 3 days around Raasay and Rona in a Palm long john anything would be better. Suppose if you found a fresh water stream/waterfall you could wash it while wearing it too? 4thE Shorts and t-shirt, with a dry cag could be an idea?
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Post by adrian j pullin » Sun Feb 24, 2008 8:01 pm

How does the 4th element stuff compare with Reed Chilcheeter?

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Post by Douglas Wilcox » Sun Feb 24, 2008 8:40 pm

Hello Adrian I have both fourth element and chillcheater. The chillcheater top is really well made (and after sales support is superb) but it only stretches one way, is not as warm in cold weather, is hotter in hot weather as it is not very breathable and is not as warm swimming in cold water it is also more prone to damage by snagging than the fourth element. The difference is in the material used. Since I bought fourth element I have not used my chillcheater.

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Post by Owen » Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:03 pm

The 4th element fabric is much softer so it's more comfortable next to the skin and it is a lot more breathable. I often wear the 4th element top and keep a chillcheater top handy; the two together work well and you don't need a cag as well.

I've not tried swimming in the 4th element stuff so can't say how warm it is in the water; but I'm very impressed with the warmth of chillcheater.

As to chillcheater being prone to damage. At one of the Anglesey symposiums Chris Reed invited a friend and I to test some of the fabric to destruction. My friend and I are both ex-paratroopers, we are quite big boys, we went at the task with enthusiasm. That fabric is a lot stronger than people seem to think.

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Post by Mark R » Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:05 pm

Does the Fourth Element stuff look as daft as the Chillcheater gear? Seriously?
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Post by Owen » Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:09 pm

Mark R wrote:Does the Fourth Element stuff look as daft as the Chillcheater gear? Seriously?
No. It looks like fleece fabric, the outer finish is smooth and as it has a lot of lyca in it it fits quite tightly. You need to order at least one size larger than their charts say.

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Post by NeilG » Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:14 am

Mark R wrote:Does the Fourth Element stuff look as daft as the Chillcheater gear? Seriously?
I've always suspected that Chillcheater supply 'other' clothing too. I know wher I will be going next time my gimp suit needs to be replaced...
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Post by Simon Willis » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:52 pm

I've just recorded a podcast with Chris Reed. I accidentally called it gimp-wear to his face, and he was not fazed. Apparently, they get some very unusual enquiries and it is used at fetish parties, whatever they are...

It's also worn by actors under costumes - they're doing the new Bond film. Podcast coming soon.

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Post by ChrisS » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:11 pm

The most bizarre garments I have seen made out of chillcheater aquatherm are a cocktail dress and bolero jacket. Worn by a lady of course. I'm sure you can guess who.

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Post by ChrisS » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:17 pm

Fourth Element stuff looks this daft:
Image

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Post by Mark R » Sun Mar 02, 2008 8:19 am

I was looking through the Thermocline site - they don't do any leggings, just a wetsuit -ongjohn-style item (£120!). I usually hate longjohns due to the shoulder restriction - any idea how restrictive these are?

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Post by Douglas Wilcox » Sun Mar 02, 2008 8:28 am

Hello Mark I have the long john.

Due to the stretch, it is not restrictive, however I do not wear it as a long john. I just pull it up as a high waisted trouser and do not bother with the shoulder straps. This means there is great overlap, so no cold back in the kayaking position.

It is also still possible to do the necessary, if you wear it under a dry suit with a pee zip.

Douglas

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Post by catman » Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:42 am

Mark, save yourself all that money on new kit by just paddling slower!!
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Post by Adrian Cooper » Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:23 pm

Simon Willis wrote:I've just recorded a podcast with Chris Reed. I accidentally called it gimp-wear to his face, and he was not fazed.
I see the new Canoe handbook has the product officially described as gimp-wear. Maybe the author was unaware of the connotation.

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Post by SteelRiverRunner » Tue Mar 04, 2008 6:12 pm

ChrisS wrote:Fourth Element stuff looks this daft:
Image
Or, indeed, this daft... :o)

Image
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Post by Mark R » Tue Mar 04, 2008 11:16 pm

I can't quite get my head around the Fourth Element longjohn - can't grasp the sense of paying £120 for a pair of longjohns that - like Douglas - I'm not likely to use as longjohns.

I wonder if any bright spark in their organisation has noticed that most people, most of the time, wear trousers.
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Post by Erling » Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:10 am

My NRS Hydroskin longjohn is just 0,5 mm neoprene (plus lining) and very flexible. They make trousers and shorts in the same material too. I find the shirt a bit restrictive around the chest though.

A quick search revealed that NRS Hydroskin clothing is available in the UK through waterantics.co.uk. The trousers are 60£ and the shorts 55£ on sale now.
Last edited by Erling on Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by andreadawn » Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:52 am

I have the Fourth Element vest and long sleeve tops, and very comfortable they are too, but like Mark I wish they made some long trousers. I currently wear Reed Aquatherm trousers with them; the pre-bent ones with the very high back, so the two garments overlap even when sitting or stretching.

Reed do make a fleecy version of their Aquatherm trousers, but I can't decide if they would be too warm on not.

Kokatat also make something similar but nowhere in the UK stocks it. I'm tempted to order these specially but I already have cupboards full of stuff that turned out to be not quite what I wanted.

Erling, I've looked at the NRS stuff on their website. Is the outer wind and waterproof or is it ordinary neoprene with some sort of fleecy lining?

Andrea.

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Post by Erling » Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:19 am

andreadawn wrote:Erling, I've looked at the NRS stuff on their website. Is the outer wind and waterproof or is it ordinary neoprene with some sort of fleecy lining?
It is a wetsuit garment and as such not waterproof. I'd say that it is pretty windproof though. A big advantage is that it dries very quickly. Here is how NRS describes and illustrates the material:
http://www.nrsweb.com/shop/material.asp
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Post by corgimas » Wed Mar 05, 2008 3:32 pm

ChrisS wrote:Polartec Aqua Shell leggings made by Kwark.
Those look exactly like my old Rapidstyle fuzzy rubber pants.....EXACTLY......i love the Rapidstyle ones....have not worn them out yet tho......
r

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Post by ChrisS » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:32 pm

Buying things from Germany is quite difficult in my experience since they don't seem to like credit cards.

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Post by Cornholio » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:49 pm

Has anyone tried any of this stuff?
http://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/product_ ... cts_id=765
It's also there as long sleeve option.
http://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/product_ ... ts_id=1406
Another pesky longjohn
http://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/product_ ... cts_id=919
Shorts
http://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/product_ ... ts_id=1368
trousers?!

This gear seems marketed to be worn either under a wetsuit (no danger of this with mine...) or a drysuit. If it's polypropylene then it's basically plastic clothing, so would it be awful in summer?! The short sleeve top and shorts might be ok though, and the top could be used with my Palm longjohn.
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Post by ChrisS » Fri Sep 26, 2008 10:01 am

like Mark I wish they made some long trousers
I contacted Sharkskin about paddling trousers and they said they would supply me with a pair direct to the UK for a total cost of $Aus209 (£94) including shipping ($Aus30). Posted for information - I am not in any way connected with Sharkskin.

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Post by Dave28 » Fri Sep 26, 2008 4:32 pm

Milos in February (which may be slightly warmer than GB in summer) I wore immersion research top and long trousers with a shortie longjohn wetsuit.

The IR stuff took the cold shock quite nicely when I went for a swim, and didn't chill off afterwards.

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Post by Kayak-Girl83 » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:21 pm

I just wear my bikini, my fella wears his mankini!

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