Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Inland paddling
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Bashy
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Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Bashy »

Hi folks.

I have recently started with WW, having done the Intro to WW at LV and I'm pretty much hooked, FYI, I can do a 1:5 roll ratio in still water lol

I cannot use LV until i have more experience and able to pass the Legacy assessment, but to do that I have to take the next course as there is no WW here in Norfolk.

My other option is to visit HPP or Northampton as i don't think the have an assessment requirement as such, the downside there is, that there is a requirement to roll (as per their ToC's seen below), I am going to assume they mean able to do all three, I will add that i have sen many a video where folk have ended up swimming at both HPP and Northampton but they do show a reasonable level of competency.
By signing this document you are declaring that you are competent in White Water use and that you can successfully perform;

1. An Eskimo roll in grade 3 white water
2. A Self rescue in grade 3 white water
3. A safe swimming (defensive) position in grade 3 white water
Now for the LV assessment, they do ask you to do a roll but its not a fail if you cant complete the roll as long as you show competency on the water and not hinder other kayakers (i wish the latter applied to kayakers learning, others were always getting in our way, enough that i had to abort many times).

With that in mind, if i found someone that would be willing to take me under their wing, how strict is the "rolling" requirement?

Or am I stuck with having to gain my experience by paying for courses?

BTW i am a fairly competent kayaker, I even did part of my 3 star at HPP bak in the early 90's but alas, most of that knowledge fell by the way side or has changed in such a way that i had to adapt and re-learn. anyway, carry on :)
Franky
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Franky »

If you're a beginner, Nene Valley (Northampton) is the better option. It's Grade 2 except for one Grade 3 drop, and good for developing skills such as eddying out. It's quite shallow though - if possible, restrict your rolling practice to the deep pool below the Grade 3 drop!

Lots of beginners paddle the Nene, and I wouldn't have thought that a bombproof roll is expected, whatever the T&C's say.

I'd recommend going with somebody else to the Nene, if you can, as I'm not sure what safety setup there is on public sessions (I've been with my club a couple of times, and we provided our own safety).

As for HPP: it's a good course, but probably not ideal for beginners, especially those paddling solo. It's a step up from the LV Legacy - Grade 3 most of the way, with river-like features such as diagonal and irregular waves. I don't think there is any safety, so if you come out of your boat you're on your own. The course doesn't have an end as such - it flattens out and then re-enters the River Trent, so there is a small but definite risk of losing your boat!

There is no travelator. When you reach the bottom (by accident or design), it's a quarter-mile walk back to the top.

The water at HPP can be notoriously manky. Even on a good day, the smell (and colour) is not nice. You can get sick just from immersion (you don't need to swallow water). So for that reason too, it is not a place you want to swim if you can help it.

What I'm saying is that HPP is not really a beginner's course.
Sean_soup
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Sean_soup »

Franky wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 12:06 pm
The water at HPP can be notoriously manky. Even on a good day, the smell (and colour) is not nice. You can get sick just from immersion (you don't need to swallow water). So for that reason too, it is not a place you want to swim if you can help it.
I was sick as a dog once after visiting HPP and not even paddling! I did buy a sandwich from the cafe though, make of that what you will..
TheEcho
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by TheEcho »

Why don’t you join a club, who will have coaches to take you under their wing as you say, and as you improve, there will be peer support for rescues? As Franky says, clubs will often book out the whole course and provide their own safety cover so you don’t have to sign to say you can do anything. Added bonus if the club is near you, you can ride share.
Bashy
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Bashy »

Hi, I am in a club over this way but sadly they don't want to do artificial courses, that club is about an hr away, it's my closest lol, joining another is a possibility, it's finding one...
Bashy
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Bashy »

Franky wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 12:06 pm
If you're a beginner, Nene Valley (Northampton) is the better option. It's Grade 2 except for one Grade 3 drop, and good for developing skills such as eddying out. It's quite shallow though - if possible, restrict your rolling practice to the deep pool below the Grade 3 drop!

Lots of beginners paddle the Nene, and I wouldn't have thought that a bombproof roll is expected, whatever the T&C's say.

I'd recommend going with somebody else to the Nene, if you can, as I'm not sure what safety setup there is on public sessions (I've been with my club a couple of times, and we provided our own safety).

As for HPP: it's a good course, but probably not ideal for beginners, especially those paddling solo. It's a step up from the LV Legacy - Grade 3 most of the way, with river-like features such as diagonal and irregular waves. I don't think there is any safety, so if you come out of your boat you're on your own. The course doesn't have an end as such - it flattens out and then re-enters the River Trent, so there is a small but definite risk of losing your boat!

There is no travelator. When you reach the bottom (by accident or design), it's a quarter-mile walk back to the top.

The water at HPP can be notoriously manky. Even on a good day, the smell (and colour) is not nice. You can get sick just from immersion (you don't need to swallow water). So for that reason too, it is not a place you want to swim if you can help it.

What I'm saying is that HPP is not really a beginner's course.
Opps, i thought i had clicked reply on this one, evidently i dindt and just closed the lappy down , sorry...

Hi Franky and thank you for such an informative and helpful reply, i could kick myself, i wish i had started back into kayaking years ago as i used to live in Northants, sods law and all that. Again, thank you, i will see if there are any FB groups for NV and give HPP a miss :)
TheEcho
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by TheEcho »

Both Lee valley and the nene have “house” clubs you can join based at their sites if nobody can suggest one closer to your home.
Franky
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Franky »

TheEcho wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 6:52 pm
Both Lee valley and the nene have “house” clubs you can join based at their sites if nobody can suggest one closer to your home.
The LV Paddlesports Club requires you to have passed your Legacy assessment to go on the course on club nights (Wednesday):

http://www.leevalleypaddlesportsclub.org/?page_id=321

You can attend one of their development sessions without having passed the assessment, but I don't see any currently scheduled. (I'm a member and have just checked.)
Bashy
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Bashy »

Franky wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 8:23 pm
TheEcho wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 6:52 pm
Both Lee valley and the nene have “house” clubs you can join based at their sites if nobody can suggest one closer to your home.
The LV Paddlesports Club requires you to have passed your Legacy assessment to go on the course on club nights (Wednesday):

http://www.leevalleypaddlesportsclub.org/?page_id=321

You can attend one of their development sessions without having passed the assessment, but I don't see any currently scheduled. (I'm a member and have just checked.)
Thank you, it looks like I will have to do the LV Developing WW and see how I fair after that, thanks guys...
gp.girl
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by gp.girl »

Bashy wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2023 6:19 pm
Franky wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 8:23 pm
TheEcho wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 6:52 pm
Both Lee valley and the nene have “house” clubs you can join based at their sites if nobody can suggest one closer to your home.
The LV Paddlesports Club requires you to have passed your Legacy assessment to go on the course on club nights (Wednesday):
http://www.leevalleypaddlesportsclub.org/?page_id=321
You can attend one of their development sessions without having passed the assessment, but I don't see any currently scheduled. (I'm a member and have just checked.)
Thank you, it looks like I will have to do the LV Developing WW and see how I fair after that, thanks guys...
Maybe worth an email to Lee Valley Paddlesport Club. By the sounds of it once you can eddy in and out you will pass asthe legacy assessment is about control and safety, rolling is a bonus until you get on the Olympic.

Did you dare the assessment in the end?
I can roll :)
Bashy
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by Bashy »

gp.girl wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2023 6:04 pm
Bashy wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2023 6:19 pm
Franky wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 8:23 pm

The LV Paddlesports Club requires you to have passed your Legacy assessment to go on the course on club nights (Wednesday):
http://www.leevalleypaddlesportsclub.org/?page_id=321
You can attend one of their development sessions without having passed the assessment, but I don't see any currently scheduled. (I'm a member and have just checked.)
Thank you, it looks like I will have to do the LV Developing WW and see how I fair after that, thanks guys...
Maybe worth an email to Lee Valley Paddlesport Club. By the sounds of it once you can eddy in and out you will pass asthe legacy assessment is about control and safety, rolling is a bonus until you get on the Olympic.

Did you dare the assessment in the end?
Hi, thanks for the reply, I can eddy in and out in a fashion, but not confidently yet and I doubt I could manage it before the second drop. I need to do the Developing white water course next. I think I emailed LV paddles ports club and they came back with a price and it was was way out of my budegt.

No, I never did do the Legacy assessment as I think it would be a waste of money, I am fairly sure I would fail, that's not being negative, I haven't even been cached down the whole course yet, although, the intro to WW course coach took 3 of us further up the course than he normally would, we were hitting the realms of the Developing WW course at the end.

As soon as it warms up again I will book the next corse and go from there, I am also working on my rolling in the pool so there's that, sadly I hurt my should hanging off the side of the pool practicing the hip snap, crazy I know, I did so much this year and it's the pool that got me lol
gp.girl
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Re: Northampton or Holme Pierrepont use.

Post by gp.girl »

Surprised LVPC were expensive.

I did my worse shoulder injury in the pool too. It's survived a lot of upside down moments, terrible bracing, autorolling and once bracing on rock in freefall and takes months to recover from mucking around with a pool float.
I can roll :)
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