Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

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Sikak
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Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by Sikak »

Hi All

I'm thinking to take a new boat and I would like to have some suggestion from the forum,
I'm looking for speed, good second stability in routh condition and that can be use both for short and long trip and
usually I do not carry a lot of weight maybe around 80-90 kg included myself,
Well first thing that came in mind was the Nordkapp LV, do you recommend it?
I have been tried the Nordkapp RM, and I liked it, is any much difference with the LV?
What other kayak may you can suggest otherwise?

thanks
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Taran Tyla
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Taran Tyla »

Luv, Luv, Luv my Nordkapp RM. If she could just lose 8 kilo's she'd be perfect...
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Douglas Wilcox
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Douglas Wilcox »

Image
Well I like mine a very great deal, especially in rough water, and I am 90kg without camping gear. Having said that, the cockpit ergonomics are completely crap, compared with Rockpool and P&H. Although mine is 5 years old, I have also tried a 2011 model. I couldn't get comfortable because of the seat and lack of thigh grips. I would need to lower the seat and alter its angle. Mine had to go back to Valley three times to fix manufacturing defects but after the third I was very pleased with the outcome. Steen in Denmark has just bought one and is not very happy with the workmanship.

Image
The ripples in the bow section of the hull look terrible. It's a pity as the demo Valley Etain I tried in Oban earlier this year was absolutely blemish free.

Douglas
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Kate D »

I just love this boat, a Cetus LV. Here she is loaded up for a 4 day journey and still room for a trolley inside.

Image
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Jim »

Douglas Wilcox wrote: Steen in Denmark has just bought one and is not very happy with the workmanship.

Image
The ripples in the bow section of the hull look terrible. It's a pity as the demo Valley Etain I tried in Oban earlier this year was absolutely blemish free.

Douglas
That should never have had a deck bonded to it.
I have seen some right proper screw ups when I used to build dinghies (gelcoat not catalysed, epoxy mix ratios wrong, epoxy applied without hardener) and I can't ever recall seeing anything quite like that. The laminate should cure in the shape of the mould, those waves suggest to me something didn't cure, or wasn't cured when the hull was released, or only part cured because of a mix problem. These things usually show up very soon after you take a hull out of a mould, maybe it didn't this time. Problems in the actual laminate we usually used to spot the second day before applying final layers - these things are rare though and someone gets a severe telling off (our materials cost on most of the boats was more than the retail price of a kayak). The only scenario I can think of for this to have got to a customer is that the problem didn't manifest until after it left the factory. I really hope Steen gets a happy resolution, there is about 40 years of reputation at stake in that photo - I'd hate for Valley to lose it because I love their boats.
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gasserra
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by gasserra »

Douglas Wilcox wrote:Steen in Denmark has just bought one and is not very happy with the workmanship.
While I agree with the comment, I have to ask:
-- if it looked like that when he bought it, why did he buy it?
-- If he ordered it, and it looked like that on arrival, why did he accept it?
-- if that happened after he took possession, how can that happen?
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Douglas Wilcox »

Hello Gassera
-- if it looked like that when he bought it, why did he buy it?
Both Steen and I ordered specific colours, we did not buy our kayaks after seeing it in stock in a showroom.
-- If he ordered it, and it looked like that on arrival, why did he accept it?
In my case (and I guess Steen's) the kakak arrived by carrier at my house wrapped up in several layers of bubble wrap, cardboard and parcel tape. It takes about 45 minutes to unwrap one and inspect it, the carrier won't wait that long and you sign the receipt "Goods unopened, no sign of damage on packaging".

In my case Valley and the dealer I ordered it through were very keen to sort it out and they did so to my complete satisfaction.

Douglas
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watt
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by watt »

P&H has several great boats in the LV range - give them a try. Tested a Scorpio LV recently (too big for me). Hatch covers are so much better. The only thing I dislike is the new skeg system. the old one was IHMO much better.

Such work as above should never leave the factory. A bad day when it was made can happen, but usually the boats should be controlled before shipped.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Ceegee »

Douglas Wilcox wrote: Image
Aw that is just inexcusable, especially when I compare it to my Alaw, which looks like it is sculpted from a block of polished basalt! Looks like they were in a rush and popped it from the mould way to early.
Cheers,
Steve C. G.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

gasserra wrote:-- if it looked like that when he bought it, why did he buy it?
Love makes blind, does it not. ;)
gasserra wrote:-- If he ordered it, and it looked like that on arrival, why did he accept it?
I picked it up at the store... Only excuse I got, is that there was no sun that day.
gasserra wrote:-- if that happened after he took possession, how can that happen?
Not possible.

I should very much know better, that I do know what things are supposed to look like (last picture, give it a click): http://menzi.dk/kajak/html/stormlt2.html

Met Andy from Valley at Anglesey Symp 2011. We had a talk, he looked at the boat, took some photos, etc. He had actually expected the error to be less than it actually was. The good news is that he promised me a new boat..!!
Last edited by bondo on Thu May 12, 2011 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

Ceegee wrote: Looks like they were in a rush and popped it from the mould way to early.
I agree.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

Douglas Wilcox wrote: Well I like mine a very great deal, especially in rough water, and I am 90kg without camping gear.
That explains why I felt challenged in the worst part of the 'funny water' areas at Anglesey... ;)
Douglas Wilcox wrote:Having said that, the cockpit ergonomics are completely crap
Fits me very well. Did (the usual) work on thigh-grips though.
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M-J-B
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by M-J-B »

viortisi wrote: I have been tried the Nordkapp RM, and I liked it, is any much difference with the LV?
The LV is a great boat. I'm totally satisfied with mine (although the carbon/kevlar hull did have a series of air bubbles near the skegbox causing a leak after landing on a beach with fine "soft" sand). Out of interest I have tried many competing products but I have not found a better performing kayak although there are manufacturers that seem to do better quality laminate and detailing on their boats. The only modification I have done is lowering the seat as far it can go, but I later took it back up half the distance I originally lowered it to. The cockpit ergonomics are perfect for me without any padding but sadly I can't sit that comfortably in an RM regardless of the wider adjustment options on the RM.

Compared to the RM, the LV is slightly more agile and the stability curve is less forgiving. The LV accelerates quicker and I can push the LV to higher top speed than the RM. Overall the LV requires less effort to keep it moving. The weight carrying capabilities are lower on the LV and loading the LV to more than 105kg total weight (paddler + gear) takes it outside my comfort range although I know it can carry more if necessary. My weight is 70-75kg so I did have to replace some of my camping gear with lightweight alternatives and leave some luxury items at home on longer trips, but that is a compromise I was prepared to do. My standard setup of camping gear + food and water for 3-4 days sums up to approx. 24kg (including PFD, spraydeck, two paddles and other kayaking essentials) which I'm quite happy with. (I used to paddle a Jubilee which was a cargo ship compared to the LV and I learned some bad habits carrying gear I would never use, easily hauling 45kg and more.)

All in all I find the LV quite different from the RM and I highly recommend you try one. To me there is no competition, the LV is clearly the winner but the RM is none the less a great product.
Sikak
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by Sikak »

Thanks all for the information

Has anybody a Nordkapp LV near Aberdeen, so I can have a look at it?
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by swagstaff »

Douglas I did manage to scrounge one of the older seats last time I was at Valley and I now find the Nordkapp LV really comfortable especially in the rough stuff and it has been rough this last week and I have been out 6 out of the last 7 days,
If anyone wants to borrow it its the demo boat sitting in Sea Kayak Oban. TheNordkapp RM & the Nordkapp Comp are there as well. The Etain LV should be in very soon and it has a similar fit to the Nordkapp LV so might well work for you viortisi.
WHITEWATER ALL YEAR LONG
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by Douglas Wilcox »

Stuart>
I did manage to scrounge one of the older seats
When the Nordkapp LV was first launched the plastic seat was narrower and sat lower in the kayak. After trying the demo kayak from Scottish Paddler Supplies, 5 of us larger guys ordered Nordkapp LVs. none of us fitted in any more. The plastic seat was wider and higher than in the demo kayak.(It was one that was used across the Valley range including wider kayaks). Unfortunately it sits very high in the Nordkapp LV. This might suit LV people but it didn't suit us, so we managed to get 5 of the narrower seats and those let us fit in.

Stuart told me he was disappointed with the ergonomics in the Nordkapp LV, he had in the shop, in fact he could only just squeeze in. I tried to fit but it was like Cinderella's slipper. So I brought my Nordkapp LV into the shop and Stuart fitted straight in. If you do have muscular thighs it will be definitely worthwhile experimenting with the seat and perhaps replacing it if you want a lower position. I also think that a lot of the Nordkapp LV's tippy reputation is due to the high standard seat.

With my weight and a low seat, the Nordkapp LV is wonderful in the rough stuff.

Douglas
mick m
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by mick m »

I replace just about all my seats with a seat carved out of closed sell foam, ther worm to sit on in winter and cool in sumer.

This week I looked at the new P&H rotomolded boats , which are now avalabel in a new shop near me, realy impresed with ther bild quolity, and thear seats, all id need to do is replace the back rest with sumthing a bit lower and it wold be grate.
the boats we are geting over hear have both a skeg and a rudder, is this to make both camps happy or to mentaly torcher both camps????????
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by orton1966 »

Aw that is just inexcusable, especially when I compare it to my Alaw, which looks like it is sculpted from a block of polished basalt! Looks like they were in a rush and popped it from the mould way to early.
Being 100% honest that’s the first time I’ve seen that photo and obviously if I was the customer I wouldn’t be happy. So I welcome a contact direct from the customer concerned to try and get to the bottom of the problem and hopefully rectify it to his/her satisfaction.

Whist some peoples inputs are warranted I have to clarify and defend Valley’s position. Firstly; Valley do make more composite boats than any other UK manufacturer and thankfully quality problems are rare but as with any other handmade product there will always be exceptions, when they happen we generally put our hands up and try to sort them out. I can however guaranty with almost total certainty that the pictured kayak didn’t leave the factory looking like that! The most likely cause in this case is a combination of heat and pressure most likely caused in transit. Fortunately these things are rare but I have seen them on almost all makes of composite kayak. Think how hot the dash of your car gets on a hot day if parked in the sun, a closed lorry is no different, if badly loaded these things can happen. Where possible we try to arrange door-to-door transit with our dealers but sometimes they arrange their own transport, sometimes loads are unloaded from one truck to another by people who care less about our products than we do.

Anyway I digress basically I will try to find where we are with that particular customer and if we can resolve it to his satisfaction

Regarding the Nordkapp LV this has been our best selling kayak for the last couple of years and as those who have them will testify it is a great all round sea kayak. Another to consider is the new Etain 17-5 (the smaller of the two sizes available) this has very nearly the speed of the Nordkapp LV but with a little more stability and slightly better tracking. Compared to other boats mentioned in this thread it is similar in width and stability to the Cetus MV but generally regarded to track a little better and have slightly better handling in wind and waves (read the Ocean paddler review on the slightly bigger 17-7 version) Also for those who are not fans of the Nordkapp cockpit and thigh grips, the Etain has better knee/thigh location and more conventional thigh grips that are better suited to supplementation with foam for a true custom fit.

As with anything kayak related my advise is try before you buy, any of the kayaks mentioned will do the job you want but experiencing them first hand will let you make the right choice for you
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by orton1966 »

gasserra wrote:--
Met Andy from Valley at Anglesey Symp 2011. We had a talk, he looked at the boat, took some photos, etc. He had actually expected the error to be less than it actually was. The good news is that he promised me a new boat..!!
Although I hadn't seen the boat or the pic's it does sound like we are sorting something out.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by Douglas Wilcox »

A few years ago I posted a long term review of my Nordkapp LV. I have not changed my opinion at all since then. The only additional comment is that it makes a fantastic kayak to put a Flat Earth sail on.

Peter's mention of an Etain 17.5 sounds salivatingly good!

We really are spoilt for choice with all these recent British designs and most of them are actually made in Britain!

Douglas
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

orton1966 wrote:
gasserra wrote:--
Met Andy from Valley at Anglesey Symp 2011. We had a talk, he looked at the boat, took some photos, etc. He had actually expected the error to be less than it actually was. The good news is that he promised me a new boat..!!
Although I hadn't seen the boat or the pic's it does sound like we are sorting something out.
Certainly.!
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

orton1966 wrote:
So I welcome a contact direct from the customer concerned
This has been done, I have no reason be believe that it won't be dealt with.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by Ceegee »

orton1966 wrote: I can however guaranty with almost total certainty that the pictured kayak didn’t leave the factory looking like that!
Fair play to you Peter, and as I understand it is being sorted. As the maker of the quoted comment, I only made it in view of the photo posted which is pretty "black & white". I still have the utmost respect for the Valley brand which is understandably popular, and a British classic to boot. All the more sad for us all when (rare) incidents like this tarnish the good name. Surely then an insurance claim against the shippers? A set of photos as it left the factory, and a factory QC sign-off would surely admonish Valley of any fault?

Also a former happy Nordkapp paddler, & aspiring Anas Acuta owner!

Regards

Steve
Cheers,
Steve C. G.
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by wideblueyonder »

orton1966 wrote: The most likely cause in this case is a combination of heat and pressure most likely caused in transit.
This makes a lot of sense - I have a 'dent' in a composite boat caused by combination of summer heat and a week strapped down to car too tightly.
Douglas Wilcox wrote: the demo Valley Etain I tried in Oban earlier this year was absolutely blemish free.
Can echo this comment - the demo Valley Etain (definitely a different one) I had for the OP review was beautifully finished. Have recently had a good look over/sat in the Etain 177 and Etain 175 Woodmill Shop have in stock at present and these were also superbly finished.

Good to hear that Valley are responding positively/quickly to the Steen's issues as well as involving themselves in this discussion.

Duncan
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by sleepybubble »

Coming back on post and following a PM.... I wrote the following reply. Just including here as it may be pertinant for somebody in the future.
viortisi wrote:Subject: help needed Alaw bach/Nordkapp LV
sleepybubble wrote:
shreds wrote:Hi,

Am thinking of buying one of the above and prob wont be able to do prolonged tests in either of these (Alaw bach or Nordkapp LV)...or long enough anyway. Main question is that which of these would best fit a slim 6ft-er (75kg) for a day + paddling without inducing chronic pain.

Am an inteemediate paddler who would mainly be doing day trips with the odd weekend and very odd week. THink prob either of these would be suitable but any feedback would be much appreciated, especially regarding comfort.

THanks in advance
Dave
I'm probably about the same build, 6'2" and not exactly heavy. I've been consistantly paddling in an LV for a month or two now. Absoloutly love it. I can get my legs out of the keyhole whilst floating which is a great novelty! plus my size 13 feet have plenty of room even if I do choose to wear wellies instead of Booties which I rarely do. I've fallen out the seat when rolling, due to slender hips but that was easily solved when I actually bothered to look at the outfitting as it has adjustable hip pads which can be padded out but still leave the factory finish on the outside, so no need for ghastly gaffa tape everywhere. SKeg slider is set far enough back to not catch on our knees, unlike some other Valley boats I've tried.

Used mainly for day tripping with just the day hatch stuffed. I have camped a few times overnight with it though in the past few months and with a careful approach to packing there is plenty of room. Laden or unladen I have never noticed it to be a tippy boat at all, seems very stable to me but that is down to personal perceptions. Try both before you decide.

Cannot comment on an Alaw as nobody out here has one to try, I saw one once it looked pretty!

Mark

Hello Mark

just sow your post and I thought maybe you can help me about a doubt with the Nordkapp Lv
I'm planning to buy a new kayak Nordkapp LV, but unfortunately I had never the chance to try it, the only model I was able to source was the RM plastic one here in Shetland.
Do you know if there is much difference between the RM and LV?
I was able to fit on the RM perfectly the cockpit size and my legs and feet were really comfortable, but I'm not sure about the LV.
I'm 1.78 m and 78kg, 10 feet size, do you think the LV will be fine for me?
thanks

Vincenzo
sleepybubble wrote:Vincenzo,

I've not been in an RM Nordkapp, but I have been in a H20, a Jubilee and a HM, all in Glass. A plastic Avocet, and a Glass Pintail. I found the fit of all of them to be fine with the exception of the Pintail which has a much narrowed Keyhole at the front that makes getting legs out on the water quite tricky, plus the skeg slider box was right where my knee wanted to be.

I think if you fit into an RM Nordkapp comfortably then you should find the LV fine. Youre a bit shorter than me but about the same weight, I find that I have to pad the hips out a bit depending on what I am wearing to keep good contact with the boat.

THe LV is more playful than the Standard build Nordkapp, but it is a full length boat, for your hieght I would suggest you maybe consider getting a go in an Avocet. I know how hard it is to try boats out though when you live on the islands :) I take it you are in the Shetland club. If not join, there is bound to be a good selection of boats to borrow/try out.

I can only advise you to try before you buy though, I know how it can be though when you have the money ready to spend and the right boat is on ebay or somesuch and you just want to do it.

Good Luck,

Mark
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?^

Post by Aleut »

Hi there,

Do you want to buy a second hand Nordie LV? I have a second hand one to sell. It's a beautiful kayak- 4 or 5 years old, one careful owner, in very good condition.
You can see it on the Knoydart website here where it's currently stored.

http://www.knoydart.co.uk/display_other ... dkapp%20LV

Ignore the guide price- PM me if you are interested.

Rhiannon
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Re: Nordkapp LV suggestion?

Post by bondo »

Douglas Wilcox wrote: Steen in Denmark has just bought one and is not very happy with the workmanship.

Image
The ripples in the bow section of the hull look terrible. It's a pity as the demo Valley Etain I tried in Oban earlier this year was absolutely blemish free.

Douglas
Just a follow up. Valley kept their word. I do now have a brilliant looking NordLow. :-)
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