DSLR^

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AllanC
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DSLR^

Post by AllanC » Wed Dec 29, 2010 9:11 pm

An old chestnut I know but I'm looking for some advice before I take the plunge. I've had access to a dslr camera for over a year now and fancy investing in my own. As I've taken more shots the more I've enjoyed it, but the owner of the one I borrow isn't a paddler and reasonably isn't keen on letting me take it out. I've been looking around, and I've narrowed down what I'm thinking about to:
Olympus e-450 for £334 here; http://www.pixmania.co.uk/uk/uk/3037798 ... 0-150.html with a standard and a zoom lens. This is similar to the one I've been using (a couple of generations newer) but looking round there isn't the range of accessories readily available for the likes of Nikon/Canon and I photography is something I'm taking to, so I don't want to be struggling for upgrades should the time come.
The other I was looking at was the Canon eos 1000d probably with just the standard IS lens to start with, which seems to be about £360 in most places, but I was shopping locally and found the eos 450d for £399 which I cannot see a price match for anywhere online. I've spent the last couple of days wading through the forum and online reviews and just ended up confused. Some say the differences between these two are night and day, others you can't get a fag paper between.
I was hoping to get set up for about £400, but I'd spend the whole lot on the 450 if it's worth the stretch.
I will get a zoom but probably wait a bit or see what turns up on ebay.
Thanks in advance
Allan C

Colin C
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Re: DSLR

Post by Colin C » Wed Dec 29, 2010 9:46 pm

Allan, first off I can understand your confusion, I sought help from a friend who is a semi pro, he favoured one brand over the other, but the advice that I found most useful is to touch and play with the different brands, they do feel different. Go with the ergonomics of it, at my level I cant use all the camera can do, but if you find it easy to use and fits your hand then that is a good start, and you will use it more and it should become second nature.

Colin

RichardCree
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Re: DSLR

Post by RichardCree » Wed Dec 29, 2010 9:58 pm

Hi Alan,

Have a look at the sony alpha range, i started with the a100 and now use the 700 both are great, i take it everywhere i mainly use a 70 -300 g series lens great for most things i do, i also use an 11-18mm lens for garden shots lets me get the full picture when i dont have the space to step back. i found the more i used the camera the more i enjoyed it learning something new is always good.

if you want a look / shot of mine give me a shout your not a million miles away, we could have a paddle.

good luck

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Jim
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Re: DSLR

Post by Jim » Wed Dec 29, 2010 11:23 pm

One thing I have found between Canon and Nikon in the past is that the controls are effectively on the opposite side of the camera, for some people one layout feels natural, for others the other layout does. Try as many as you can, but chances are if you are used to the Olympus now, you should probably look for something with a similar layout.

Jim

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maryinoxford
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Re: DSLR

Post by maryinoxford » Wed Dec 29, 2010 11:42 pm

If you decide on Canon, be aware that they have an Ebay shop, Canon Outlet:
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Canon-Outlet?_rdc=1
Items sold here are "refurbished," sometimes ex-demo or otherwise repackaged, but they do come with full warranty. I've had a scanner and a compact camera from them, with no problems.

I don't know if other makers have similar outlets, but it's worth a look.

Mary
Not in Oxford any more...

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wideblueyonder
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Re: DSLR

Post by wideblueyonder » Thu Dec 30, 2010 8:47 am

My advice would be to look past your current £450 budget and look towards the future. To explain:

You may end up very happy with the camera and lens combo you buy now and never want to add to it or upgrade it in any way, however, the chances are you will. The problem comes if you buy one brand of camera and then later on realise that you want to swap to another brand as you then have to buy a new camera body and lenses.

If you choose the right camera now, then you could add extra lenses and then if you ever decide to upgrade the camera body you can use all the same lenses.

Canon and Nikon have the widest range of cameras and accessories, as you have pointed out, at the widest range of prices as they dominate the market. This makes them very attractive as you can buy a decent entry level camera and lens and then over time find suitable extra lenses or an upgrade to the camera body at a budget to suit.

However, I opted to ignore this advice and bought a Pentax as it has a reputation for excellent weatherproof/dustproof seals and I take lots of pictures from the kayak or on the beach, often at night in drizzle or misty, freezing weather. However by choosing Pentax, I have severely limited myself in number of upgrades or extra lenses and the range of prices of accessories. There are only 4 camera bodies available and a very low number of lenses compared to Nikon/Canon. But, I'm happy with my choice!

Hope this helps - best of luck choosing!

My kit set-up is written up on my website
Also worth looking at Mark Rainsely's website

John N
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Re: DSLR

Post by John N » Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:04 am

I have a PENTAX W60 compact which I take with me most of the time. I've never taken my CANON EOS500 on the water yet. I think analogue and it's taken me a lot longer than I expected to get used to the 500, though probably no longer than any other digital DSLR. The 500 does come with the latest version of CANON'S software, I believe the 400 / 450 comes with the earlier DIGIC 3 software but quite what the difference is I'm not to sure.
What I have taken on the water is my old FUJI S5100 (similar models available) as this 'bridge' camera offers better performance than a compact (but not as good as a DSLR) with a 10x zoom permanently attached. I wouldn't want to be changing lenses in anything other than millpond conditions. FUJIFILM also has an outlet shop that I have used in the past and the service and quality has been quite good. Just one small cosmetic scratch on a pair of compacts.
https://secure.fujifilm.co.uk/shop/consumer/digital/
Keep posting, I'd be interested to see where you go from here. I might take my 500 on the water yet!

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wideblueyonder
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Re: DSLR

Post by wideblueyonder » Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:23 am

I f you do take the Canon out on the water I use and massively recommend the Ortleib Aqua Zoom. It came recommended to me by Douglas Wilcox and has been superb. I have it strapped to the deck of the kayak on almost every paddle. Still takes nerves to take the camera out of the bag on the water but yet to have an accident and the pics are worth it!!

I bought mine from here - very fast delivery and reasonable price.

Jonny-the-ski
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Re: DSLR

Post by Jonny-the-ski » Thu Dec 30, 2010 10:42 am

As an alternative - and more bang for your bucks, have a look at the Sony DSLR's, if on a Budget the A200.
Now, as a bit of unbiased background, I used to run a photo studio/gallery (bangwallop in Salcombe). We used to run courses with some of the worlds top photogs (Charlie Waite, Jo Cornish, Kos Evans & Rankin to name but a few). On these we'd get folk turn up with all sorts of the latest kit, Phase One to D3X Nikons. I used to do the post production, and was constantly amazed by the quality and detail of the little Nikons. For the consumer/semi= serious you get a lot of very good gear for very little. As Sony bought Minolta - it is tried and tested, the have just made it better. Lenses are cheap too. I get to use works camera's Phase One P65 and D700's - but if buying - I'd get a Sony.

DaveSt
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Re: DSLR

Post by DaveSt » Thu Dec 30, 2010 1:03 pm

I may get around to tentatively taking out a DSLR, whilst on the water. Though if I do so, it will be an old Nikon D40 that I picked up cheaply second-hand. Depending on what you're going to use your photos for, this one is (and plenty of other makes/models are) good enough for high quality 10 x 8 inch prints. Picking up one of the older Pentax's with a water-resistant* body, and using the WR lenses, might be a good option... especially for the faint hearted.

Camera bag? - will probably try a "Camera Armor Seattle Solo Waterproof Dry Bag", as here (may be cheaper elsewhere).

...Dave...

(* No DSLR is water-proof!)

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CaptainSensible
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Re: DSLR

Post by CaptainSensible » Thu Dec 30, 2010 2:27 pm

I've used my DSLR on the water before. It's not impossible and can be perfectly safe, but it is a bit of a faff.

If I can ever afford it, I might use a high-end digital compact camera that shoots RAW files (like this one) with it's built-for-it waterproof housing instead.

I usually recommended Canon or Nikon because they're the ones with complete systems of everything (and are used by the majority of professionals), but Sony (ex-Minolta) and Pentax and so on are fine if you're only ever going to buy a camera body plus a couple of lenses.

I have a Canon 400D (which is very similar to the 1000D and the 450D) with four lenses (two of fixed focal length/primes and two image-stabilized zooms), but I just went to an online retailer and made up a basket of a 1000D plus those four lenses. Total = £1116.97.

But lots of "professional" lenses (like this one) cost more than that, and that's just only the beginning (check out this lot). I'm not really "committed" to Canon at all.

So if you're only ever going to spend £500 (let alone £1000), there's lots to choose from.

I'll write more later.

maxturner
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Re: DSLR

Post by maxturner » Thu Dec 30, 2010 3:12 pm

I've used the cheaper Canon and Nikon DSLRs and prefer the Panasonic Lumix G series to both of those brands, i currently use a G2 and can't fault it at all, link to some pics..http://www.flickr.com/photos/maxturner/ the first page and half of the second are on the G2

Owen
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Re: DSLR

Post by Owen » Thu Dec 30, 2010 3:37 pm

CaptainSensible wrote: But lots of "professional" lenses (like this one) cost more than that, and that's just only the beginning (check out this lot). I'm not really "committed" to Canon at all.
I could well be wrong, as these are all well out of my price range. But, I was under the impression that the "professional" Canon L-series lenses would only fit on the "professional" cameras at the eye wateringly expensive end of the range. i.e. D5's and the like.

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CaptainSensible
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Re: DSLR

Post by CaptainSensible » Thu Dec 30, 2010 3:55 pm

Those (EF) "L" lenses will will fit on any EOS body, including my 400D. There's nothing to stop someone spending a five figure sum on an EF lens and sticking it on a 1000D, which is nice.

However, the (EF-S) lenses designed for EOS camera bodies with APS-C sized sensors (like my 400D) won't work with EOS camera bodies that have 35mm or "full frame" sized sensors (5D or a 1Ds) or APS-H sized sensors (1D).

More here.

Owen
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Re: DSLR

Post by Owen » Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:51 pm

CaptainSensible wrote:Those (EF) "L" lenses will will fit on any EOS body, including my 400D. There's nothing to stop someone spending a five figure sum on an EF lens and sticking it on a 1000D, which is nice.

However, the (EF-S) lenses designed for EOS camera bodies with APS-C sized sensors (like my 400D) won't work with EOS camera bodies that have 35mm or "full frame" sized sensors (5D or a 1Ds) or APS-H sized sensors (1D).

More here.
Oh! I got it the wrong way round. Still doesn't make them any more affordable. Every now and then I look at the secondhand websites but they're still to expensive for me. Maybe one day I'll win the lottery.

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Jim
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Re: DSLR

Post by Jim » Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:33 pm

I use my D80 on the water (it's a bit old now, about £650 body when new) and before that an F80 and F65's, there is one unbreakable rule when using an SLR in the boat - 'No capsizing'. Most of us are able to manage to fiddle with all sorts of things from the cockpit without falling in - maps, GPS, VHF, food, drink, sails - as a general rule I stop using the camera a bit before I would stop using most items on that list but the main reason is probably my closure system - my older aqua zoom doesn't have a handy zipper so it takes a while to clip the first seal together and then roll up the second seal, this is the time I feel most vulnerable.

Fortunately (?) the first seal on mine is cracking up so I'll have to replace it and maybe extend my amount of camera usage.

I keep a big sachet of silica gel in the bag along with a bar towel. Nikon SLRs and DSLRs seem to be fairly water resistant and the odd splash does no harm. The consistent dreach today did keep the camera in the bag in otherwise ideal (calm) conditions, partly because of the rain, and partly, well:

Image

There wasn't much to take photos of!

AllanC
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Re: DSLR

Post by AllanC » Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:32 pm

Thanks all for the messages and pms I recieved on the topic, I picked up a Canon 450 today to beat the VAT increase, and I must say I'm very happy with it. The camera will probably live initially in the knee hatch of the Cetus when on the water, and when funds allow look at better bags etc. Now the process of learning to use it properly begins!
Thanks again everyone

Allan C

Big Ade
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Re: DSLR

Post by Big Ade » Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:38 pm

Hope you're going to have a long and happy time together with no untoward plops.
Now to hyjack your finished thread, appolgies.

What Gets me about Cameras for the sea is the lack of a viewfinder and that the lens alway seems to be covered in spray just as you are about to get that all imortaint action shot.
Number one gripe- need a viewfinder on a robust compact for straightening the horizon and getting a good composition.
Two, need that compact to be ready to take pretty darned instantly with a clean lens whilst using just the one hand...

I am still trying to find a digital to beat my film Pentax zoom 90 WR complete with bottle top lens cap.

Are there any yet?

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