Leaky Drysuit

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jackp
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Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Have got two typhoon drysuits , the multi sport and curve 4
It seems that in the big chop the waves and spray get in despite being a good fit (it’s almost like a mist when it’s taken off but mostly dry )
Does anyone wear a large cag over the top or a sailing spray suit maybe ?
Just tried the brand new typhoon suit and has a similar problem but the problem seems to get worse the more they get used .
My older ones is now due for warranty repair as it’s got so bad and for some unknown reason the main material itself develops small not visible leaks

PlymouthDamo
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by PlymouthDamo »

I've had lots of leaky drysuits, but never worn a cag over them - either fix them or ditch them. It can be very difficult to diagnose the source of your sogginess. Over the past few months, I started getting increasingly wet in my favourite drysuit - mainly around the waist and backside. I was pretty sure I'd got a leaky zip or seam around that area, but after changing the neck seal, it's bone-dry again - the water must have been getting in and running down. That could happen with a brand new suit if the seal is too big for you.

See what they find on the warranty repair - hopefully, they'll have decent test facilities and can identify where the water's getting in, which might help you with your other suit. And have you ruled out sweat? If you're working hard in a drysuit, you can be pretty damp afterwards even if you haven't been anywhere near the water.

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

PlymouthDamo wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:30 pm
I've had lots of leaky drysuits, but never worn a cag over them - either fix them or ditch them. It can be very difficult to diagnose the source of your sogginess. Over the past few months, I started getting increasingly wet in my favourite drysuit - mainly around the waist and backside. I was pretty sure I'd got a leaky zip or seam around that area, but after changing the neck seal, it's bone-dry again - the water must have been getting in and running down. That could happen with a brand new suit if the seal is too big for you.

See what they find on the warranty repair - hopefully, they'll have decent test facilities and can identify where the water's getting in, which might help you with your other suit. And have you ruled out sweat? If you're working hard in a drysuit, you can be pretty damp afterwards even if you haven't been anywhere near the water.
I was wondering though if it’s partly because they are sold as surface drysuits and not like the diving ones but when I first got the multisport it didn’t let hardly anything in when fully submerged . Sweat could be a possibility aswell as do hard training sessions but probably less likely to be the problem .maybe I will fully test the new one tomorrow and go for a swim

PlymouthDamo
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by PlymouthDamo »

jackp wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:51 pm
I was wondering though if it’s partly because they are sold as surface drysuits and not like the diving ones but when I first got the multisport it didn’t let hardly anything in when fully submerged . Sweat could be a possibility aswell as do hard training sessions but probably less likely to be the problem .maybe I will fully test the new one tomorrow and go for a swim
3 of my paddling buddies have got new typhoons and they're all reporting them as dry, even though they're doing loads of rolling in them. All drysuits should be dry - the only functional difference in a diving suit would be the addition of inflator and dump valves. Tomorrow, put on some cotton clothing under the suit when you go for your swim and make sure you do a duck-dive or two. When you take the suit off you should be able to locate the general location of any leaks by the damp patches on your clothing. The usual suspects are the neck seal, zip or seams.

Chris Bolton
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Chris Bolton »

After you put the suit on, do you have to release air from the cuff ? If so, it's not leaking and moisture must be sweat. Typhoon, and repair guys like Rubberman, can do pressure tests, but sealing it round your self and squatting works.

ChrisJK
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ChrisJK »

I bought a fairly old Typhoon dry suit for £25 which had a ripped neck seal which I fixed with storm sure and Sello tape. internal wear spots with Stormsure and strips of old Goretex finished off with a reproof with Nikwax TX direct and bees wax on the zips. I can't roll but it has held out in wet weather. I have avoided using it other than in the cooler times of the year otherwise I think it as a recipe to boil in a bag.

I have alongside this found that treating old Goretex and other fabric coats (I am an outdoor worker and a cheapskate!) with Nikwax waterproofing wax for leather which has basically turned them from leaky sieves to oilskins.
I think any wax proof coating such as Gwax or that used for wax cotton jackets would do a similar job.
I have not plucked up the courage to try it on my Typhoon dry suit but It might just come to that but I've not shelled out too much hard cash.

ike
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ike »

“it’s almost like a mist when it’s taken off but mostly dry”
What you’re describing OP is condensation (warm, moisture-laden air inside your suit that condenses when exposed to the cooler outside air). It’s sweat that your drysuit’s fabric has been unable to vent through its breathability. Putting a cag over the suit will only make this breathabiity problem worse.

Have your tried one of the special soap wash products like this


By the way, if you do try to wash it, just use a hand wash in a big bucket or the bath; don’t use the washing machine (despite what it might say on the bottle). I won’t bore you with the details, but the machine basically destroyed a good drysuit even after running it empty twice before loading my suit, and running it on a cold slow wash.

seawolf856
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by seawolf856 »

ike wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:27 am
“it’s almost like a mist when it’s taken off but mostly dry”
What you’re describing OP is condensation (warm, moisture-laden air inside your suit that condenses when exposed to the cooler outside air). It’s sweat that your drysuit’s fabric has been unable to vent through its breathability. Putting a cag over the suit will only make this breathabiity problem worse.

Have your tried one of the special soap wash products like this


By the way, if you do try to wash it, just use a hand wash in a big bucket or the bath; don’t use the washing machine (despite what it might say on the bottle). I won’t bore you with the details, but the machine basically destroyed a good drysuit even after running it empty twice before loading my suit, and running it on a cold slow wash.
Sports Direct have the Tech wash on offer for £3.99 at the moment. I've just washed my Kokatat dry suit in the bath in cold water using the tech wash and couldn't believe the amount of dirt that came out of the fabric. I suffer from personal condensation (sweating) a lot - even in my top of the range Kokatat, but the improved breathability after the wash was noticeable.

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Thanks for the input on this guys .
I am usually a strong paddler but got down the one of the usual spots this morning and decided not to head out as weather but too wild .would anyone actually be mad enough to paddle for an hour into a force 9 onshore wind with the tide at its highest so even more wind chop .

ike
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ike »

Someone else stood on another shoreline this morning looking out at similar conditions, and chose to head out. A kite surfer in Ireland. I’m sure he didn’t think today would be the day he didn’t come home. Stuff happens fast in those conditions. You made the right decision jackp.

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Yes very unlucky what happened to the kite surfer earlier today and as you rightly said the conditions can change very quickly so definitely not for the beginner or intermediates levels . I do wonder if he possibly got blown onto a rocky coastline with some big wind gusts with not much time to react or simply went too high in the air and came down too fast
Anyway I will try again tomorrow to get out but lauch at a lower tide if it’s still an onshore wind .

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

The newer typhoon suit had another test run today. .been tried 4 times now and bought as a spare, its definitely not completely water tight compared to the multisport version .its correct fit with tight seals but maybe I was expecting too much from a 300£ surface drysuit??

ike
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ike »

Are you sure the wetting you’re experiencing isn’t just overheating inside the suit? If your thermals are wet in small patches then those wet areas are probably where the water is getting in. But if your thermals are wet all over then it’s likely to be an overheating / breathability issue.

Chris Bolton
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Chris Bolton »

maybe I was expecting too much from a 300£ surface drysuit
I don't think you are. A new drysuit shouldn't leak, and Typhoon are a respected brand. Is it airtight? If it holds air and balloons out when you walk into the water, it will hold out water, and if it doesn't hold air you should see bubbles escaping.

Beryl
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Beryl »

The cheaper Typhoon suits are mostly the same materials with less pockets/relief zips etc. I’ve the cheap Hypercurve with an old fashioned back entry that is so designed that is easy to enter/leave so not needing the relief zip. At £220 six months ago it’s a bit of a bargain IMHO. Price of this suit varies enormously mind so ferret about...
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jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Chris Bolton wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 5:18 pm
maybe I was expecting too much from a 300£ surface drysuit
I don't think you are. A new drysuit shouldn't leak, and Typhoon are a respected brand. Is it airtight? If it holds air and balloons out when you walk into the water, it will hold out water, and if it doesn't hold air you should see bubbles escaping.
That’s intresting and not tried that yet as always burp the air out before setting off ........Perhaps if I just wear a t shirt underneath it will be less noticeable but I usually only wear a thin microfibre fleece anyway, If I fully submerged myself how dry should it be if it’s sold as a surface drysuit ?

ike
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ike »

Dry!

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Also got a more technical question .when would the incoming tidal flow go at its quickest? From what I’ve noticed It seems to be around 3.5 hrs before high tide then slows down and gets slack

Chris Bolton
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Chris Bolton »

always burp the air out before setting off
If you have to burp the air out, it's not leaking much. A sign of a drysuit ageing is when you don't have to burp it.

Tidal streams along the coast at at the mouth of an estuary are usually fastest at mid-tide, but as you go further up an estuary, the fastest flow gets closer to the start of the flood, until you get rivers like the Severn where it comes in a bore.

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Just been out in the new ish drysuit again today and this time only the front of thighs are wet but it seemed watertight when I tested it a few weeks ago. Maybe the hypercurve 4 just isn’t a good build quality but the multisport eventually had similar problems after a few years

Beryl
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Beryl »

Why don’t you do some exercise in the suit a mile away from water and see what happens?
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jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Beryl wrote:
Tue Dec 29, 2020 7:58 pm
Why don’t you do some exercise in the suit a mile away from water and see what happens?
Hi might get some funny looks and probably nothing much would happen anyway unless i went for a long run .they could be handy though for the local shopping runs to protect against corona but don’t forget the snorkel and mask or they won’t let you in

jackp
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by jackp »

Wet again today in same place but it’s strange as it still holds a lot of air when burping it and seemed ok when I’ve tested it and also there are no signs of wear and have only used this new suit around 15 or 20 times .looks like another typhoon warranty return coming up

Chris Bolton
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Chris Bolton »

If you think it's leaking somewhere in the legs, turn it inside out, hang it up in the shower and fill the legs with water. You'll see where the leaks are, if any.

Franky
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Franky »

Maybe an obvious thing, but if it's leaking around the thighs, are you sure the relief zip is done up properly? A few times when I first got my dry suit, it leaked and I discovered it was because I hadn't given a strong enough yank.

EDIT: Looks like the Hypercurve doesn't have a relief zip so I guess it's not that.

ike
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Leaky Drysuit

Post by ike »

A drysuit will only work properly if the humidity outside the suit is lower than inside the suit. If you’re doing a hard workout, this differential will eventually be lost inside a sealed cockpit. The moisture inside the suit’s legs then condenses into water. I find it wets the seat and feet areas first, then thighs. Stop paddling into a Force 10!

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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Beryl »

Chris Bolton wrote:
Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:15 pm
If you think it's leaking somewhere in the legs, turn it inside out, hang it up in the shower and fill the legs with water. You'll see where the leaks are, if any.


That’s going to put huge forces on the seams as most leg sections will have reinforcements that are at right angles to the weight.

There is a huge problem with dry suits. Unless it leaks in some obvious focal point you just can’t lay the blame anywhere with certainty. I’ve now tried five and all have a strength but none have delivered. You just have to juggle the compromise. Me? I like the ChillCheater for you can hardly feel your wearing it, but has a adjustable collar. The cheap Typhoon hypercurve because it’s sturdy and its shoulder zip allows to to get out of it quick enough to not need a relief zip , but the wrist and cuff seals weep. Plymouth Demo has suggested there are expensive solutions to this from the scuba community

The goretex route I’ve only had experience with walking jackets. It’s promising but has too much of a premium to dip a toe if your kayaking IMHO.
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Chris Bolton
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Chris Bolton »

That’s going to put huge forces on the seams as most leg sections will have reinforcements that are at right angles to the weight.
Maybe 20kg per leg? It didn't do my suit any harm, but keeping the feet on the floor would reduce it. The seams are vertical on my suit.
Unless it leaks in some obvious focal point you just can’t lay the blame anywhere with certainty.
I've only had a couple of leaks in the body of a drysuit (4 suits over 31 years) and they were either obvious pinholes from a sharp object, or found by the method I suggested. Leaks from the neck and cuffs excluded, you can usually work out if they're ageing.

But I have, on a day when I was badly overdressed, had enough condensation to pour it out of the feet when I finished.

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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by ChrisJK »

I have a pre owned Typhoon dry suit complete with convenience zip suit which I got for £25 so I don't ask too much of it. I realise that in various circumstances they can basically be 'boil in a bag' suits that probably extends to quite a lot of various price options or am I wrong?
I have seen folks do rolls to cool down. I appreciate that if one takes a swim what one is wearing could be a matter of life and death but perhaps if you are heading out into heavy winds and working hard possibly it could be perspiration rather than leakage?

Beryl
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Re: Leaky Drysuit

Post by Beryl »

Chris Bolton wrote:
Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:17 pm
That’s going to put huge forces on the seams as most leg sections will have reinforcements that are at right angles to the weight.
Maybe 20kg per leg? It didn't do my suit any harm, but keeping the feet on the floor would reduce it. The seams are vertical on my suit.
Keeping the feet on the floor would help. So would a video of this experiment. I made a round hole of a 1” thick bit of plastic to fit the neck of my ChillCheater suit. I added a bicycle valve to pump up the suit. It located tiny leaks when sprayed with soapy water and didn’t stress any seams I’m thinking.
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