Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

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Pedro75
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Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Anyone got any suggestions for cheap old WW boats that surf beach waves well? I was out in my old Corsica yesterday and found it to be a bit too keen to broach. I’m looking for a bit of a stepping stone to hopefully getting a surf boat at some point.

There’s a Whip-it for sale locally. Anyone know how they fair in surf?
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by kayak1 »

I have a Riot Disco for sale..good in the surf with fins included...£200 excellent condition
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Thanks - i’ll do a bit of research and bear it in mind.
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Chris Bolton »

Is a Riot Showbiz any use? £50?
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Thanks Chris but i think I’m thinking along more old or older school lines e.g. Acrobat 270 (had one about 20 years ago)
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Chris Bolton »

I do actually have an Acrobat 270 which I might sell; usual scratches but no damage, turquoise colour. PM me an offer if you like? I don't have photos but could take some.

Not sure where you are, as if you have to travel far cheap boats become expensive! I'm in Warrington, Cheshire, 5 min off the M6/M62.
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Ah thats tempting but I’m in Cornwall so that’s probably a bit too much of a challenge
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by StoneWeasel »

There is a magical period of playboats where the hul;ls were fast, the ends were slicy and we were not into butt bouncing yet so the rocker was progressive.
Any of the boats from this era are golden. The Necky boats from this era are the best surf hulls of any white water boats ever, in my opinion anyway.

Essentially, if there is not a sharp change of angle in the rocker (a rocker break to enable butt bouncing) then you are golden.
Anything from a Prijon Alian / Perception Mr. Clean era up to around the Riot Glide. After that the rocker breaks started to get too pronounced and slow the hulls down too much.

The best of the best of the plastic hulls for surfing, in my opinopn is that of the Necky Jive 8'10" (With the sandard Jive coming in a close secone).
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Any thoughts or experience on the folllowing for a novice surf kayaker who’s never paddled a playboat? They’re all available locally-
Pyranha inazone
Perception whip-it
Riot Dominatrix 44
Perception Arc

I’m guessing the Arc and whip-it would be less able to carve? Bear in mind that after front and side surfing on tiny waves for years I’ve only just grasped the concept of trying to steer in anything other than a straight line 😂
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by kayak1 »

The Inazone would be a good boat for starting out in the surf, if you're more confident then the Riot Dom 44 would do...followed by the whip it...in that order!..in my opinion anyway!
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

yep, confidence is not my strong point so I’m looking for something forgiving really
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by StoneWeasel »

Pedro75 wrote:
Sat Nov 26, 2022 1:57 pm
Any thoughts or experience on the folllowing for a novice surf kayaker who’s never paddled a playboat? They’re all available locally-
Pyranha inazone
Perception whip-it
Riot Dominatrix 44
Perception Arc

I’m guessing the Arc and whip-it would be less able to carve? Bear in mind that after front and side surfing on tiny waves for years I’ve only just grasped the concept of trying to steer in anything other than a straight line 😂
Innazone would be great, whip-it and Arc would be good, Dominatrix would be intersting.

The whip-it and Arc can carve really nicely, the only thing that you might find harder than the Innazone, is then releasing that rail for a snappy turn, which will be easier in the Inaazone.
The dominatrix is a lot of fun in the surf zone in a masochistic sort of way but probably not what you are after right now.

Hope that helps,
Denzil
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

kayak1 wrote:
Sat Nov 26, 2022 2:20 pm
The Inazone would be a good boat for starting out in the surf, if you're more confident then the Riot Dom 44 would do...followed by the whip it...in that order!..in my opinion anyway!
StoneWeasel wrote:
Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:50 pm
Pedro75 wrote:
Sat Nov 26, 2022 1:57 pm
Any thoughts or experience on the folllowing for a novice surf kayaker who’s never paddled a playboat? They’re all available locally-
Pyranha inazone
Perception whip-it
Riot Dominatrix 44
Perception Arc

I’m guessing the Arc and whip-it would be less able to carve? Bear in mind that after front and side surfing on tiny waves for years I’ve only just grasped the concept of trying to steer in anything other than a straight line 😂
Innazone would be great, whip-it and Arc would be good, Dominatrix would be intersting.

The whip-it and Arc can carve really nicely, the only thing that you might find harder than the Innazone, is then releasing that rail for a snappy turn, which will be easier in the Inaazone.
The dominatrix is a lot of fun in the surf zone in a masochistic sort of way but probably not what you are after right now.

Hope that helps,
Denzil
Ace - thanks for the info. Just to throw a spanner in the works there may be a necky jive 8’10 available although it would involve a bit of a drive!
So bearing in mind I’m looking to build confidence-
out of the Jive, Innazone and whip-it any thoughts which is likely to be the most forgiving in terms of paddle out, pearling and ability to catch green waves?
I’m wondering if the length of the necky might make it good in those respects followed by the whip-it then innazone. Would that seem right?
Hoping I might be able to pick one of these up at the weekend and get surfing (if I can shake this cold off)!
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by StoneWeasel »

Pedro75 wrote:
Tue Nov 29, 2022 5:09 pm
...out of the Jive, Innazone and whip-it any thoughts which is likely to be the most forgiving in terms of paddle out, pearling and ability to catch green waves?
I’m wondering if the length of the necky might make it good in those respects followed by the whip-it then innazone. Would that seem right?
Hoping I might be able to pick one of these up at the weekend and get surfing (if I can shake this cold off)!
Easiest Paddleout: Jive
Easiest to avoid pearling: Whip-It by a small smidge but you will very quickly get the technique of lifting a knee to prevent pearling and then all of them are fine
Easiest to catch a wave: Jive

To be perfectly honest, you will be fine in any of those three. They are all great intro to the surf boats and will all be good for getting the skills together for progressing to a full surf boat down the line.

If you are not already awar of it, I highly reccomend checking out SurfKayakSkills.com too. It is a fantastic free resource
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

StoneWeasel wrote:
Wed Nov 30, 2022 3:31 pm
Pedro75 wrote:
Tue Nov 29, 2022 5:09 pm
...out of the Jive, Innazone and whip-it any thoughts which is likely to be the most forgiving in terms of paddle out, pearling and ability to catch green waves?
I’m wondering if the length of the necky might make it good in those respects followed by the whip-it then innazone. Would that seem right?
Hoping I might be able to pick one of these up at the weekend and get surfing (if I can shake this cold off)!
Easiest Paddleout: Jive
Easiest to avoid pearling: Whip-It by a small smidge but you will very quickly get the technique of lifting a knee to prevent pearling and then all of them are fine
Easiest to catch a wave: Jive

To be perfectly honest, you will be fine in any of those three. They are all great intro to the surf boats and will all be good for getting the skills together for progressing to a full surf boat down the line.

If you are not already awar of it, I highly reccomend checking out SurfKayakSkills.com too. It is a fantastic free resource
Brilliant - thanks StoneWeasel and thanks for the link👍
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by muddy_duck »

Hi,

Are you still looking for a Jive 8.10 ? its been a great boat in the surf as others have said. The Jive and a Riot Boogie got me into kayak surfing. I may be tempted to part with mine, as I am not using it as I now have composite boats.

How far down into Cornwall are you? I'm based in South Wales, but have a project in Exeter, so could meet somewhere. If interested I shall take some photos for you

Peter
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

muddy_duck wrote:
Fri Dec 02, 2022 6:05 pm
Hi,

Are you still looking for a Jive 8.10 ? its been a great boat in the surf as others have said. The Jive and a Riot Boogie got me into kayak surfing. I may be tempted to part with mine, as I am not using it as I now have composite boats.

How far down into Cornwall are you? I'm based in South Wales, but have a project in Exeter, so could meet somewhere. If interested I shall take some photos for you

Peter
Thanks Peter, should be good for now. I’m looking at a whip-it and inazone tomorrow but I’ll keep your jive in mind should those not work out.
Cheers, Pete
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

Well after a fair bit of driving I’ve ended up with a very tidy Whip-it and a pretty rough inazone. Off to the beach tomorrow!
Thanks for the help 👍
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by StoneWeasel »

Awesome!

Let us know how you get on
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Pedro75 »

StoneWeasel wrote:
Tue Dec 20, 2022 2:04 pm
Awesome!

Let us know how you get on
Well, slow progress so far.
I’ve been out with the new boat(s) 3 times now. First went to Hayle rivermouth. There wasn’t really any surf but it was a good chance to try both the inazone and the whip it. In the few tiny waves I caught the inazone seemed to be good fun. It was a bit of a shock paddling such short boats as I’m more used to sea kayaking. It was very odd to see the front of the boat going straight through the waves rather than lifting up over. Had a go at stern squirting the whip it too.
Next trip was to Harlyn. Forecast was 3-5 foot. Mrs P was going bodyboarding and I took the inazone. I got in and paddled into the soup and just got pararlysed by the sight of a few 6 footers closing out and dumping right in front of me. I decided I was pushing my luck, dragged the boat up the beach and just went for a swim in the surf. Had a go on Mrs P’s bodyboard with all my kayaking kit on (including drysuit) and was surprised how well it worked. Got a few funny looks though.
Despite the conclusion of my thread on what to wear surf kayaking I decided to buy a winter wetsuit. This is so I can take both my bodyboard and kayak to the beach, get a bit of dopamine catching some waves on the bodyboard and then jump in the kayak.
Today we went to Porthluney. Forecast was about 3 foot and seemed spot on to me. No wind and blue sky! It was quite busy with surfers. I put the whip it on the beach and went out bodyboarding. I left it a bit long really but I finally switched to the kayak. It was a good move to do a bit of bodyboarding first as it flicked the fun switch. Sometimes kayaking can make me really nervous.
I caught a few waves in the whip it. It pearl dived loads but I think I was too slow taking off. When I did catch a few waves I was really surprised how twitchy it felt. Probably as I’m used to a sea kayak! I did manage to carve left and right a little bit. I got flipped a few times and apart from one occasion when I was pinned against the back deck with my face in the sand with my spray deck pulled off I rolled every time. I also came up smiling. I decided to go straight to pawlata for now to build confidence and it worked a treat.
After a short session in the boat it was time to get out and have some lunch. It was great timing as just as we were sitting down on a rock to have a picnic someone with a kernow kayaks boat turned up (anyone here?) and showed me how it’s meant to be done!
So a good day with a few positives to take away.
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by Franky »

Pedro75 wrote:
Mon Jan 02, 2023 3:21 pm

Well, slow progress so far.
I’ve been out with the new boat(s) 3 times now. First went to Hayle rivermouth. There wasn’t really any surf but it was a good chance to try both the inazone and the whip it. In the few tiny waves I caught the inazone seemed to be good fun. It was a bit of a shock paddling such short boats as I’m more used to sea kayaking. It was very odd to see the front of the boat going straight through the waves rather than lifting up over. Had a go at stern squirting the whip it too.
Next trip was to Harlyn. Forecast was 3-5 foot. Mrs P was going bodyboarding and I took the inazone. I got in and paddled into the soup and just got pararlysed by the sight of a few 6 footers closing out and dumping right in front of me.
I go surfing from time to time in a Jackson Rockstar playboat. It took me a while to work out that when punching through waves I needed to lean all the way forward, right into the guts of the wave. At first, my instinct was to shrink back, which is the worst thing to do.

I was experimenting the other day with different ways of getting out through waves. This was in 3-to-4-footers. The obvious method is the same double power stroke you use to get through holes on white water: one big stroke before the crest of the wave, and another big stroke afterwards to release you from the towback. And leaning right forward all the time.

For bigger waves, a method that seems to work is to hold the paddle out in front of you so that one blade gets hit full-on by the surf (again, while leaning all the way forward). The paddle acts as a pivot, the boat swings backwards under you as it rides the wave, and you vault over the wave. This actually seemed less tiring than using power strokes, and mostly reliable, although one time I didn't escape the wave quickly enough and surfed backwards for quite a distance, which I hope looked deliberate.

I have no idea whether these are good techniques, but it was interesting trying different things out.
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Re: Cheap old boats that are good in surf!

Post by TechnoEngineer »

Bear in mind that many whitewater kayaks are trimmed "bow heavy" to avoid them spinning when in water moving faster than the kayak.

You don't want this in surf - so it may be worth moving the seat back slightly or weighing down the stern to adjust the trim (e.g. a diving weight attached to the floor immediately behind the seat)

If you paddle it on flat water and there's a tendency to spin, then you'll almost certainly need to adjust the trim.


Also remember the "arse and sweep" technique for getting over waves when paddling out

Try to find gently sloped beaches which have more of a "spilling" type or surf as opposed to "dumping" surf which occurs on steep beaches.

If using the pawlata (or other extended paddle) roll, be sure to keep your elbows close to your body.
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