CE on FB

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TechnoEngineer
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CE on FB

Post by TechnoEngineer »

Removal of Comments, Posts & Discussions
by Canoe England on Tuesday, February 21, 2012 at 1:50pm ·

Canoe England has reluctantly taken the decision to remove all the comments, posts & discussions from the Canoe England Facebook Page which we consider to be inappropriate.

From the relentless posting of demands, questions & complaints, often when answers have already been provided by Canoe England, it has become clear that Facebook is not an appropriate channel of communication through which to hold discussions about single issues.

Facebook is a social, not an anti-social, medium. The Canoe England Page was set up to promote canoeing & enable our sport to engage with others, to facilitate positive dialogue between different members and as a forum in which to share information, ideas & tips.

It was not set up as a replacement for more established channels of communication and, as the Social Media team have publicised on various occasions, should a response to a question be desired, other forms of communication, such as email, letter or phone, should be used in the first instance.

Canoe England is not, nor ever has been, a single campaign organisation and, as such, the organisation cannot allow any single issue to continue to dominate its Social Media; it has a duty to ensure other users aren’t discouraged from engaging with the Page by the occupation of any single topic.

Whilst we investigate alternative & more appropriate forms of communication (We are currently looking into the possibility of holding regular live web chats, amongst other ideas) all correspondence relating to Canoe England matters should be directed to:info@canoe-england.org.uk

We will aim to respond to all correspondence within 28 working days though should we receive a high volume of enquiries, such as that seen on the Canoe England Facebook Page in recent weeks, this may not be possible.

Wwe have a responsibility & and reserve the right to remove any content, and those who post it, from the Page. Please see our Social Media guidelines for further clarification at:

http://www.canoe-england.org.uk/media/p ... eb2012.pdf
Commenting is an integral part of the Canoe England Facebook Page and we encourage everyone to participate, contribute and connect with us and each other.
We value your comments on our Page and are constantly looking for ways to improve dialogue so we’ve put together the following guidelines on how to make the most of Canoe England Facebook conversation threads.
In addition to helping foster great conversation these guidelines, along with the context in which comments are made, are taken into account when we make decisions regarding the content on our Page.
We have a responsibility and reserve the right to remove any content, and those who post it, if we believe it to be compromising these guidelines.
Canoe England Facebook Page: Commenting Do’s & Don’ts
Do speak from relevant and personal experience that adds value to the conversation.
Don’t post comments or links that are irrelevant to the original post or conversation thread.
Don’t post spam.
Do help us maintain inviting interaction by self-policing threads and flagging spam. Although we have a hands-on approach to community engagement, we do sometimes miss things!
Don’t use the Canoe England Facebook Page to ask questions which would be better directed at the relevant Canoe England department. Use the Page as an opportunity to share tips, information & discussions with others that are interested in canoeing.
Don’t use offensive or profane language or threaten others. Maintain intelligent discussions by being respectful & considerate to both other Facebook users and Canoe England Facebook admin.
Do engage in polite and valuable conversation threads with fellow Facebook users and Canoe England Facebook Admin.
Don’t attack fellow Canoe England Facebook Users, staff or Facebook Admin.
If you disagree with something, we respect your opinion however we expect you to share your thoughts in a constructive and respectful manner. Don’t bully, intimidate or harass. We will distinguish between constructive arguments and smear tactics.
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Strad
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Re: CE on FB : ooooooooooOOOOOOOOOoooooooooo

Post by Strad »

just read it - complete failure of how social media should be used....
Old School?? I miss my AQII..
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Re: CE on FB : ooooooooooOOOOOOOOOoooooooooo

Post by The Chuckster »

TechnoEngineer wrote:Removal of Comments, Posts & Discussions
by Canoe England on Tuesday, February 21, 2012 at 1:50pm ·

Canoe England is not, nor ever has been, a single campaign organisation and, as such, the organisation cannot allow any single issue to continue to dominate its Social Media; it has a duty to ensure other users aren’t discouraged from engaging with the Page by the occupation of any single topic.
[/quote]

So you can post up... really excited about the olympics, how do I get tickets?! By the way, what is your position about access?!!!

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Re: CE on FB : ooooooooooOOOOOOOOOoooooooooo

Post by Tom_Laws »

Jerks.

Join Canoe Wales. Move to Wales, Scotland or BC.

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Re: CE on FB : ooooooooooOOOOOOOOOoooooooooo

Post by Simon Westgarth »

The era of Web 2.0 past the BCU by, such outlets like a blog on access, coaching and the alike, would of served them well to getting the kind of interaction, they clearly do not wish to engage in on their social media outlet. This has become an issue for an organisation that is trying to avoid direct two way communications, perhaps these failings will open them up to more proactive solutions rather than reacting against members questions in such a regressive manner.

PS, printing replies in Focus or CODE, does not help either, as no one really reads these publications. Without an editorial direction, both are print news outlets, when the web has announced it all months before.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by lewis=) »

Firstly I am appalled by this response to a reasonable question although the thread was starting to get a bit repetitive when I last checked it. I am not a member (I live in Scotland and therefore am a member of the SCA) As an outsider looking at this thread and others on this forum


"From the relentless posting of demands, questions & complaints, often when answers have already been provided by Canoe England, it has become clear that Facebook is not an appropriate channel of communication through which to hold discussions about single issues"

Yet that is what they seem to be doing with any other question that is asked mmmmm...........

"It was not set up as a replacement for more established channels of communication and, as the Social Media team have publicised on various occasions, should a response to a question be desired, other forms of communication, such as email, letter or phone, should be used in the first instance."


If an email is what they want give it to them,

First option - as one email with multiple signatures pretty sure if you can get a significant percentage of the membership to put there names to it they will have to do something.

Second option (this is slightly more militant) Someone writes a template and then everyone copy's it into there browser and emails it to them separately. I cant really see how this would work but it might irritate them enough to do something.

Third option is there someone out there with the skills to create an e- petition

"Canoe England is not, nor ever has been, a single campaign organisation and, as such, the organisation cannot allow any single issue to continue to dominate its Social Media
"

Even if the the majority of there members consider this to be the only issue they should be dealing with.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Mark R »

Words fail me.

What really amazes me, is that they've taken the time to go back and and delete all comments/ requests on the subject of access for some time back, including even the ones they themselves responded to constructively and helpfully.

All these posts were apparently 'inappropriate'.

Access to rivers is apparently an inappropriate subject for discussion with CE.
Mark Rainsley
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Re: CE on FB

Post by Adrian Cooper »

Sh, don't tell anyone, I've been adding some of mine back in.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by DaveWortley »

It's clear that Canoe England have no interest in representing the majority of their members, their interests remain in Olympic and Competition elements of the sport.

I don't see why we don't form another governing body that represents the average joe recreational paddler.

Anyone want to join the 'British Canoe Association '

Let the social media community form an official voice.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Croft »

Isn't this like a web-based version of what Cameron just did with his NHS summit - don't invite anybody along who doesn't agree with you - maybe they are just towing the official line!
Ian Beecroft - old-timer amateur boater

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Simon Westgarth »

Shocking, indeed. Print media is no longer an effective information flow for their membership, they have to get on with a better news feed, that has interaction, blogs are the best way forward, especially for single or narrow focus subjects like coaching & access. I hope CE get on the programme ASAP, as today's stance is regressive, it's an association that is answerable to its membership but a company trying to control it's public appearance.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by buck197 »

Looking at some of the questions there are common themes in a lot of them surely CE could answer these common themes. Maybe someone (Not you Mark) could assemble some generic questions from these questions for CE to focus on answering? Does CE think its members are happy with the status quo which to me we are obviously not and don't be surprised if they don't commission either:

a. A University to study access and VAA.
b. A members multi choice survey so we answer their questions and not vice versa.
c. A change to the coaching and award schemes.
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Re: CE on FB

Post by hodgkins »

TechnoEngineer wrote:It was not set up as a replacement for more established channels of communication
They clearly don't understand what Web2.0 is all about. I'm sure deep down First Great Western https://www.facebook.com/FirstGreatWestern wish facebook didn't exist, but at least they've embraced it and don't dare delete posts they don't like. I'm sure there's plenty other organisations in the same boat too.

If CE don't like the idea of lots of comments on their facebook page, how about setting up a web petition? This would hopefully show there is a large number of CE members who feel passionately about the access situation and cannot be ignored or deleted one by one as the emails/comments are made.
Dave

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Tom_Laws »

These guys are much more switched on.

Click Here

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Chris Bolton »

Canoe England wrote:should a response to a question be desired, other forms of communication, such as email, letter or phone, should be used in the first instance.
So why, I wonder, did I my three emails, politely asking a reasonable and relevant question [were CE planning to respond to the consultation on reorganising the Coastguard?] get no reply whatever?

Chris

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Re: CE on FB

Post by ChrisE »

buck197 wrote:Looking at some of the questions there are common themes in a lot of them surely CE could answer these common themes. Maybe someone (Not you Mark) could assemble some generic questions from these questions for CE to focus on answering?
well it would have been possible but it's not anymore, cos all the comments have been removed.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

"Asking Questions is not a crime".....

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Re: CE on FB

Post by morsey »

quicky wrote:"Asking Questions is not a crime".....

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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

Brilliant Morsey...

"Then they paddled away".......

Someone will have a tired delete finger today on FB...

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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

I keep getting the Muppets, 'Man or Muppet' from the new film going round in my head in relation to this...

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Re: CE on FB

Post by shanclan »

Muppetry of the first order.

Join Canoe Wales.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

Apparently you can't if your a CE coach, despite the fact my club is Welsh....

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Performance Kayaks »

As a retailer, the BCU wishes us to promote them to the public as their National Governing Body and demands that we give their members a discount. A few things have occurred to me regarding this:

I would estimate that about <90% of my NEW Recreational Paddles join for the main reason of access to waterways.
Maybe 10% are coaches.
I would also estimate that less than >1% of my customers are Competitive Paddlers.

Why should I promote an NGB that doesn't want to hear issues and gives the impression that it is not interested in supporting a vast majority of its membership?

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Tom_Laws »

You've got your canals liscence. Stop your whining.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by Big Henry »

Just to divert the thread for a bit...

I believe that Canoe England is in receipt of money from the taxpayer. Does this mean it becomes liable to answering questions under the Freedom of Information Act?

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quicky
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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

From FB.

Canoe England
Clearly there are lots of people who are passionate about access to waterways. As are we. It is good to hear your comments and thoughts.
Specific questions can be directed to access@canoe-england.org.uk

Going to be a full mailbox...

http://www.taxpayersalliance.com/campai ... ation.html
Organisations subject to the Act are obliged to respond to requests within 20 working days of receiving them.
However, such laws continue to be ignored by a number of bodies, and they sometimes deliver incorrect or late information.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by whosthedaddy »

Third option is there someone out there with the skills to create an e- petition
You could try this:
http://epetitions.net/

Never used it but it might be worth a try. If a petition was successful then it lends weight to the opinions that access is an important issue for the recreational paddler. CE seem to think it is just a small group of troublemakers trying to bring their fb page down.

I would start it myself, but I am not confident I have the experience and full facts of the issue. It would also need careful wording such that it can be distributed to canoe and kayak clubs across the UK.

I would be willing to take a share in publicising the existence of such a petition.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by quicky »

petitions have been tried, (look at the number 10 site) and the 38 degress campaign with very limited respondants.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by whosthedaddy »

You need to demonstrate the support of the recreational paddlers somehow.

If a petition was created and well publicised (in the paddling press, clubs, retailers, blogs etc) but still the response is poor then the only conclusion is that it isn't in fact a big issue for most people and the BCU have won.

I don't think this is the case.

I am reminded of the campaign to influence the re-development of HPP. There was a huge response, with the result that the course was kept deep and many of the features retained and enhanced.

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Re: CE on FB

Post by morsey »

whosthedaddy wrote:I am reminded of the campaign to influence the re-development of HPP. There was a huge response, with the result that the course was kept deep and many of the features retained and enhanced.
I'm not so sure that is a true reflection of that situation, the course was developed by experts and the course was always going to be good after the work was carried out, I don't think it needed or had any alterations from the plans. The stumbling block, was the communication, or lack of it, as to the actual aspect of the redevelopment. The information was available it just wasn't passed to all paddlers. Lack of comms and BCU, now there is a shocker!

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