River Kent - Rock throwing natives

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Randy Fandango
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Randy Fandango »

I really hate people who throw stones, me.... :-)
Giles

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by jmmoxon »

I think we're also talking from different viewpoints because of the differences in society between SE London and Dartmoor (where I do most of my paddling) / Cumbria (where Stuart does most of his).

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Randy Fandango
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Randy Fandango »

jmmoxon wrote:I think we're also talking from different viewpoints because of the differences in society between SE London and Dartmoor (where I do most of my paddling) / Cumbria (where Stuart does most of his).

Mike
Well, you know I have boated quite a bit in Devon too. I just happen to work (and therefore boat every day) in SE London :-)
I get what you're saying but I think you're seeing things in a rather kindly "its not robbery -- its just a bit of scrumping!" sort of way and I guess my jaded old eyes have had that gloss removed forever by the many many occasions I've experienced incidents of this kind.
That and that I'm a miserable grumpy sod who was told today I definitely need my ears drilled.... :-(
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by morsey »

jmmoxon wrote:I think we're also talking from different viewpoints because of the differences in society between SE London and Dartmoor (where I do most of my paddling) / Cumbria (where Stuart does most of his).
I disagree http://www.ukriversguidebook.co.uk/foru ... ow#p293577.

Dimwitted fools who throw rocks know what the outcome of a rock hitting a person is, and as such when they deliberately pick up a stone and throw it at a person they take full responsibility for all possible damage that rock can do. There is no justification for it and there is no difference between louts chucking rocks off embankments or anglers hurling stones from the bank.

Calling the Police is standing up to the aggressors, writing to the fisheries complaining about their thuggish members is standing up, verbally reprimanding the offenders is another way to stand up. I would recommend keeping yourself at a safe distance and calling the Police at the time if your path is blocked or afterwards if you can carry on down river safely. Personally I have never backed down from any confrontation but that does not mean that it is the same for everyone, as with paddling rivers you have to make your own decision.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by jmmoxon »

It's still the exception in Devon, unlike SE London. I paddle on Dartmoor more often than most and rarely even see fishermen, let alone have problems - I'm not denying they exist. I'm saying I would rather approach someone who was being abusive on a moorland river than in a populated area.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by morsey »

A city dwelling mentalist or a country borne mentalist? Same choice as I see it. :-)

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by jmmoxon »

There's definitely more in the city ;-)
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by geyrfugl »

We paddled the Kent on a Sunday a couple of weeks ago, with kids, low water. We didn't see evidence of any other paddlers on the river that day. At Prizet bridge, we got out to inspect. There was a fisherman river right almost under the bridge, so we went to have a word with him, not wanting to risk getting a fishhook in the face if off-line (we had taken five nasty hooks off overhanging branches at eye-level that day, and failed to get one off where it was close to someone fishing whom we were trying to keep clear of, so didn't want to spend too long trying). He was pretty grumpy, but didn't actually have the temerity to suggest that we didn't have every right to paddle. We were past in a couple of minutes, but he stomped off to his car, apparently not willing to continue fishing once we had passed.

There were five of us, one of him. I, very visibly, had a GoPro HeroHD video camera on the front of my boat, and a waterproof camera in my hand on the bank. All the other fishermen on the bank were polite and offered no objection to our passing - we did, obviously try to look where they were casting and avoid paddling through that water.

I'm sure that paddlers being considerate and careful works quite a lot of magic, but being obviously equipped to record any incident can't do any harm. The Kent is a nice river, and goes in low water (about 0.47m on the Sedgwick gauge on the day in question, and we have paddled it a lot lower), so is inevitably a favourite venue for summer paddling - we've never had any trouble other than the occasional grump.

I can't conceive why they imagine that passing canoeists stop the fish from biting. On the Ardeche, you will see people fishing from the bank just below the put-in for the most popular section. Maybe several paddlers every minute, all day, most of whom have little control at that stage, having never paddled before, so they crash from one bank to the other, totally failing to stay clear of fishing lines and often falling in, screaming and laughing. The fishermen remain cheerful and don't seem to consider moving, even though 300m upstream there are maybe only a few paddlers each day. Why do they think there is no problem when Brits imagine that fish will stop biting for the rest of the day? How long a memory do they think fish have ? Where is the evidence for that belief ? It seems to be just the same as landowners claiming that cavers disturb grouse and stop them from breeding successfully, and not being prepared to even look at careful scientific research evidence from Scandinavia showing that even considerable pedestrian traffic has no such effect.

Believe nothing without evidence !

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Adrian Cooper »

Hallelujah!

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quicky
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by quicky »

canoeists stop the fish from biting
They don't otherwise kayak fishermen would have a very quiet time...

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by callwild »

quicky wrote:
canoeists stop the fish from biting
They don't otherwise kayak fishermen would have a very quiet time...
There are lots of different aspects and types of fishing and you can't just make such a general statement.

People fish from kayaks and boats in many places where it would not affect the fish biting, yes
But there are also places on quiet, secluded, flat rivers where a fisherman may spend hours enticing a particular fish out from a corner of a pool to get a bite. In this situation any ripple of the water or noise such as a boat, canoeist, rock or even coughing would spook the fish and spoil the catch.
In such a situation canoeists would definitely stop the fish from biting
So to use this as general comment is as relevant as saying most fish are caught by noisy boats called trawlers !!!

To get back to the Kent.
I have never seen a fisherman in a kayak there trying to fish.
The river is whitewater run where the fish will not be spooked by boats. I expect they don't even notice them

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by morsey »

callwild wrote: I expect they don't even notice them
Surely you can't just make such a general statement without researching first! I have it on good opinion from a good many paddlers that when they have found themselves in an upside down situation they have seen many fish staring at them and it has spooked them so much that they have fallen out of their canoes. Fish spook canoeists, fact!!

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callwild
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by callwild »

morsey wrote:
callwild wrote: I expect they don't even notice them
Surely you can't just make such a general statement without researching first! I have it on good opinion from a good many paddlers that when they have found themselves in an upside down situation they have seen many fish staring at them and it has spooked them so much that they have fallen out of their canoes. Fish spook canoeists, fact!!
Probably more likely, more than once I have been put off my concentration by a fish jumping close to my bow. Lets just kill all the fish then the problem would go away.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Kayacb »

[quote="callwildby]Lets just kill all the fish then the problem would go away.[/quote]

The fishermen are working on that one right this minuet.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Missed It »

Something that no-one has failed to mention,is in your calm but to the point, of the whole rock throwing incedent.Just remind the fisherman that the point he is trying to acheive in throwing at you,He is infact disturbing the water more than you are,with shouting ,stone throwing,so that makes him as guilty ,if not more than the kayaker.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Ian W »

Just paddled the Kent in high flows and lovely autumn sunshine!
Scores as follows:
other paddlers on river 0
fishermen 1
stones thrown 0
friendly nods 1

At the get out we saw some other paddlers getting ready, they asked us if we had been stoned at all !

It really isn't a regular occurance!!!

Ian.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by morsey »

Ian W wrote:Just paddled the Kent in high flows and lovely autumn sunshine!
fishermen 1
friendly nods 1
Nice one, sounds like a lovely day out on the river.

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seiont access issues?

Post by latlee91 »

Hey guys,

I am doing a leaflet on the access issues on the seiont for uni work and just wondered if any one had any were that I could access good information on this subject and books, websites, newspapers that have any information regarding this subject.

Thanks.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by shanclan »

Have a look at the Assembly inquiry into access. The responses rceived has loads of papers from individuals, the Seiony angler, EA, CCW etc.

http://www.assemblywales.org/bus-home/b ... r_main.htm

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by water-rider »

I have had the exact same problem with this on the kent, in the gorge.

A fat bloke with a red face, glasses and a flat cap? Think he's a regular.
Throws stones about the size of your fist as well.

Not pleasent.
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Mikers »

I've been paddling 30 years. Most Fishermen are fine. Recently on the itchen they have started reeling in their lines to let us pass - as soon as they see us and most are pretty friendly.

The worst I've had was a fisherman deliberately casting at me. I was 15-20m from the shore, he was on a pontoon. On his third attempt he hit me to cheers from his mates. I wound the line around my right arm a couple of times and just kept going. The cheers soon turned to shouts of "Oi - you're taking my line! Come back!" Unfortunately, despite an increase in paddling rate, the rod did't get dragged along too.

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by scottdog007 »

On Friday we were on a river and saw some kids up a head throwing stones into the river, so we expected trouble (approx 12 years old). As we got near they shouted 'show us a roll' we shouted back 'too bl__dy cold' and 'why aren't you at school' but made a joke of it and talked to them a little. They seemed to warm to us, and we paddled of without any trouble but i'm sure they had originally planned to throw stones at us.

On a previous trip on the same river a friend told me he had kids throw stones at him. He paddled over and told them if he gets hit by a stone what he would do to them. To which the kids produced air pistols and started shooting him, he paddled off quickly :-)

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by RizzRat »

These guys were out in force on Sunday - not rocks this time but casting fishing lines in front of us!

Fun times - one even tried to advise us he was the land owner and we were illegally paddling.
Generally p!ssing people off since 1984!

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by lakesboy »

errrr its the fishing season!! best to stay away from the kent this time of the year, there are plenty of other rivers locally that do not attract the same silly fisherman problems during the summer months. the lower kent will always be a problem as its a major local fishing area, and especially below force falls where both banks are owned by rival fishing clubs! damaging cars to abuse to i am the land owner comments are always going to happen in the summer months..

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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Poke »

Agree that paddling the Kent at this time of year is probably not going to make you popular with the maggot drowners, but:
lakesboy wrote:damaging cars ....[is].... always going to happen in the summer months..
Really?

Also, I can't comment on this weekend in particular, but if you've driven a long way to get there expecting lots of water, and there isn't loads, there probably aren't "plenty of other rivers locally" you can do. Lune and Leven are probably the only two, and they're just as bad.
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by Sickboy »

I wish I got a photo but I was at Isle de serre a couple of weeks ago and each day there was a bloke fishing on the course, either at the inlet or the 'normal' get out, both very busy spots, no different than someone dropping a line into Hpp, couldn't help but chuckle.
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Re: River Kent - Rock throwing natives

Post by PolecatApollo »

Catapult, under the deck rigging on show, job done haha

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