Throw bags

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Mark R
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Throw bags

Post by Mark R »

Anybody carry a second rope?
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Rich P
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A second rope ?

Post by Rich P »

It's hard enough convincing everyone I paddle with to carry one !

Rich

Dave Thomas
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Post by Dave Thomas »

Only one 15m bag normally (or two, as bow and stern 'swim lines', when in open boat mode).

But I've seen a couple of instances in the past year where a 20 - 25m bag would have been very handy for the more considered, less 'spur-of-the -moment' boat recovery phase rather than the immediate 'swimmer recue' phase (as well as one where the time taken to restuff a 25m bag after catching a swimmer was a real pain!!!).

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Adrian Cooper
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Ropes

Post by Adrian Cooper »

Nope, only one 20m line. But I have two others so I can make sure other people in the group have them. I do know some people who will carry a 15m rope handy and keep a 25m right in the back of their boat for Dave's 'considered rescue'.

Adrian

PS I have a friend who used a 25m line. He split it in two and used each end for two separate throws at a short distance when the victim surfaced after a long swim in a stopper, very confused. The victim missed the first throw even though it landed right across him, but he caught the second.

I was impressed!

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thetangoman
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2 Ropes

Post by thetangoman »

I always paddle with 2 throwlines. One 15m line in the bottle holder between my legs, which comesout whenever I get out of my boat, and a second 20m line behind the seat, which only comes out if needed. There have only been a couple of times when I have had to use both, and it was much easier having the 2 of them.

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Pete C.
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Ropes

Post by Pete C. »

I've just accidentally bought a second bag of non-floating static access line. I'm not planning on using it very often, though.

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Post by Dug »

I normaly just carry onr 15m throw line but normaly some of the other guys I'm with have lines too, although not any uber long ones

Dug

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Post by Mark R »

I intend to buy a second bigger rope (25m?) for general utility work...recommendations?
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Dave Thomas
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Post by Dave Thomas »

I like the 'Green Slime' (Suzy's) bags - nominally 8mm rope is arguably on the thin side but just about OK to grab in the water, and seems durable against abrasion etc when used for rescues. Bag is good tough material, and - most importantly - generously sized for easy re-stuffing (wide enough to get a hand into , unless you're a real gorilla, and deep enough not to have the last few metres spilling out again as fast as you stuff it in). Overall size is perhaps on the bulky size, therefore, but hey I paddle an H2 so thats not really an issue!

In fact, I'm thinking of getting a Green Slime 25m bag myself!

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Pete C.
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Rope

Post by Pete C. »

Spectra cored floating line. It's expensive but significantly stronger than polypro floating line. That's presuming you need floating rope.

HF do a 22m bag. It costs about £70. I'd look at that.

P.

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Throw Lines

Post by Adrian Cooper »

How about this as a suggestion. You carry the 15m between your legs and it doesn't really matter if it gets wet/damp. But if you have a 25m in the back of your boat for other emergencies, you don't want to be carrying aroud all the water which this could possibly absorb. Pop it in a thin plastic bag with a wire tie so it stays dry and light. When you need to use it (bank based rescue, non urgent) it doesn't take a minute to rip open the plastic bag.

Just a suggestion.

Adrian

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Post by Dave Thomas »

That's a sound idea, Adrian!

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Mark R
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Re: Rope

Post by Mark R »

Pete C. wrote:Spectra cored floating line. It's expensive but significantly stronger than polypro floating line. That's presuming you need floating rope.

HF do a 22m bag. It costs about £70. I'd look at that.

P.
I can't find anyone in the UK who sells one...?
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Pete C.
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Spectra

Post by Pete C. »

System X can bring it in to order. Just ask at your local System X stockist - it may take a while and a bit of pestering, but I think it's worth it. I remember seeing Danny Scott from Desperate Measures using one in Val Sesia last spring and a number of the N Wales guys who went out to Ecuador were using them, so they do come in.

Spectra core's not ideal as access rope (it'll still die very quickly if you use it to ab on and it's got a really low melting point), but it's slightly more versatile than standard floating line.

P.

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Post by cucc2stu »

guidebook wrote:Problem solved!

http://www.rescuerocket.com
I particularly like the look of this http://www.rescuerocket.com/tresqmax.html just the thing for making sure you get hold of that body stuck in a stopper. Wonder if it could be deck mounted...?

More seriously I generally only carry one 20m line on the basis that every one else will have one as well and so there will be at least 3 or 4 within the group. I think that is fine for most stuff. But, when you want to start tying people onto trees etc to make sure they stay on a slippery bank, then need to set up some rope system as well, or anyway, one rope each can quickly run out and then a second rope would more than prove it's worth. I can see some serious merit in the idea of having some more durable, stronger, less flexy (have you tried decending steep slopes using a throwline!?) rope in a drybag in the back in more technical situations. I've just not got round to looking into it and sorting it out.
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Rescue Rocket

Post by Guest »

Hmm, It says it does not put the operator at risk.

Doesn't say anything about the poor sod at the receiving end!

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Dug
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Post by Dug »

that rocket thing looks great!!! I gotta get one

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Post by James A Forder »

" Pete C. wrote:
Spectra cored floating line. It's expensive but significantly stronger than polypro floating line. That's presuming you need floating rope.

HF do a 22m bag. It costs about £70. I'd look at that.

P.


I can't find anyone in the UK who sells one...? "

I'm sure Palm also make spectra cored floating line bags, think Brookbank had some last time I was there and they were certainly less than £70!

James

[/quote]

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Post by Mark R »

James A Forder wrote:I'm sure Palm also make spectra cored floating line bags
Not according to their website, at least????
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Post by David Fairweather »

Don't Palm use something else that is equivilent to Spectra? I'm sure I remeber something about that from the thread a few months back on the Salamander Golden Retriever throw bags.

Actually thinking about it, that seems the most logical way to do it; carry a light weight rope around your waist / in your BA and have a longer heavy duty rope in the boat for the more technical "considered" rescues.

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2nd bag

Post by Terryg »

25m or 20m in boat (depending on boat).
15m in pocket on back of PDF as backup, or quick access for another person to grab while I am still in the boat (eg another paddler spectating ).

Personal preference is for the longer line, I have had 2 people on each end of one line before.

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Pete C.
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lines

Post by Pete C. »

Palm also make spectra cored floating line bags, think Brookbank had some last time I was there and they were certainly less than £70!
The lovely Tim from Palm wrote into Playboating in reply to someone suggesting they make spectra core lines. He said that they didn't think the advantage was that great for the vast majority of paddlers and it wouldn't be cost effective to produce them, and he's probably right on both points. Palm do make bright yellow pro-rescue lines, but it's just a thicker diameter of hollow core polypro line.

Dyneema is another brand name for stuff that is, to all intents and purposes, Spectra.
Last edited by Pete C. on Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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rope

Post by Tim Maud »

Sorry Pete, t'was I that posted replies.
We do not use spectra/dyneema lines as yet, as for our current product range we do not feel it fits.
Our high end line has a polypro core it is NOT hollow core.

We would recommend this style of rope for most rescue situations. For our reasons find the previous posts.

For our range
Click:
http://www.palmequipmenteurope.com/acat ... lines.html

Tim.
Product Designer.

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Post by Steve B »

I thought Spectra was disliked because it's too thin, and therefore more difficult to hold in a rescue situation?
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Spectra

Post by RichB25 »

Spectra isn't recommended on it's own for throwlines, instead it can be used as a core inside a polypropylene sheath. The polypropylene provides flotation and the spectra provides strength. The ropes made by bluewater (www.bluewaterropes.com) are meant to be good, but I never quite got round to getting hold of one. The combination seems like good news for a throwline, giving you more versatiliy, but I'm not convinced it's ideal for a second rope. I don't see why you'd want a second rope that floats, as you're unlikely to use it as a throwline. Instead, you might as well get some decent static or dynamic rope depending on your needs.
Rich

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JMT
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Extra line - who's going to cary it?

Post by JMT »

I like to carry a spare throw line when on harder grade or more remote rivers, usually 20/25 metres in the back of the boat, and I would normally take the trusty Salto. However when paddling my I3 with splits, spare line, slings Krabs etc and not to mention my 14 stones (sorry - only partly gone metric) it does get a bit tail happy. Start carrying solid core lines and the problem is even worse. I still think you should carry rescue kit and I have used mine on quite a few occasions, but the performance of the boat when loaded should also be considered. TRY and persuade your paddling mates to share the load!
Last edited by JMT on Mon Feb 07, 2005 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Keep pushing for fair access to all rivers (or better still, just go and paddle them!).

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throwlines

Post by chucky/ »

I think that all lines in the UK are a bit pants at the moment. I have a 25 metre palm one and its so heavy to throw, even the 15m is quite bad. I bought some for my club and some of the group find them really hard to throw.

My girlfriend has a thinner palm line which is 18m (i think they also do a 22m) which is better but not veryu strong. 500kg breakinf where the thicker ones are 1000g, so more of a swimmer rescue then boat haul line.

Here is a question for people that have been paddling for some time. I have an old line which has a red bag, with yellow stripes. The line is yelloe with red dots on it. When i bought it is was quite young so only got a 12m one. However it is the best line I have ever used. Perfect on 1st throw and re-throws. The weight is good too. Anybody know who made it. Snake River rings a bell and maybe OLS who dont exist anymore.. It attached to a towline belt as well

Chucky

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Post by cswalker »

Steve B wrote:I thought Spectra was disliked because it's too thin, and therefore more difficult to hold in a rescue situation?
Spectre comes in a huge range of diameters well up to and above 20mm. The big problem for the Recreational market, ie kayaking to name but one, is the fact the stuff is so damn expensive, always has been and always will be. The reason currently is that there is a huge huge shortage because of the military requirements for it from around the world (Iraq etc), who take priority.

The manufacturers are now working on stuff called Spectrex (tm) which is very similar but not quite as hi spec!

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