"Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Inland paddling
Post Reply
User avatar
Wildswimmer Pete
Posts: 1324
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Runcorn New Town
Has thanked: 1 time
Contact:

"Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Wildswimmer Pete »

........so sayeth Jeremy Vine on Radio 2 yesterday (7th Oct)

Precis: There is a dispute between the swimmers who swim in Henleaze Lake in Bristol and the anglers who fish the lake. The swimming club involved want to cull the huge number of carp infesting the lake and whose........err.......deposits are fouling the bed of the lake and beginning to represent a health hazard. While the piece acknowledges that swimmers have preference however it wasn't clearly pointed out that that Henleaze Lake and the surrounding land are actually owned by Henleaze Swimming Club. The fishing rights also belong to Henleaze Swimming Club and I were them I would immediately tear up the angling club's lease and tell them to "do one".

Heleaze Lake is a flooded quarry and susequently stocked with fish. In other words the carp are an invasive species and have multiplied to an extent that they are basically aquatic vermin.

Needless to say the anglers had their say, but if I recollect correctly the swimmers weren't invited to put their side. After a piece of music there were some contributions by listeners - one thumb-swiping moron told swimmers to go to their nearest leisure centre, this silly airhead obviously didn't have the wits to understand that Henleaze Lake is their swimming pool. They bought it, paid for it, and pay for its upkeep.

It's on iPlayer here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04jmh2f
fast-forward to 34 minutes.

It's available for four weeks, the piece is entitled "Ebola and carp" - I almost mis-spelled the last word ;-)

Wildswimmer Pete
Nili illegitimi carborundum

User avatar
Chalky723
Posts: 935
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:56 pm
Location: Cambridgeshire
Has thanked: 19 times
Been thanked: 12 times

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Chalky723 »

The BBC seems to be incapable of carrying out impartial and researched discussions. I can't even listen to Jermeny Vine any more - he's trying to be a "Shock Jock" for Radio 2 at the expense of any substantial content! His interviews tend to be based around speaking loudly & slowly, while ignoring the facts he doesn't want to hear.

They're getting more & more like the red tops every day.

As for the anglers, they just don't like the thought of anyone apart from themselves using and managing water....

It's not inconceivable that, eventually, angling will p*ss off enough disparate groups that a concerted animal cruelty campaign will come about & they'll all have to take up crochet....

For the record I'm a "casual" coarse, game & sea fisherman myself, as well as a kayaker, but have no time for this continual lack of a will to share the natural resources of the land....

C
Jackson Nirvana, Gumotex Palava 400

User avatar
quicky
Posts: 2986
Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:08 pm
Location: Wirral,

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by quicky »

It was a very interesting programme which just showed how some people cannot tolerate others.....

Keith Day
Posts: 205
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2007 4:42 pm
Contact:

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Keith Day »

Interesting to hear anglers arguing that the property rights of the owners are not supreme in his case as they claim they are on rivers despite the fact that there seems to be no claim of common law rights to fish. I'd like to see the stance of the Angling Trust on this.

At least part of the emotion is due to the claim that, due to infestation with parasites, the surplus fish can not be simply be moved elsewhere. Some of the anglers were disputing the risks associated with the parasites. My view is that if they can find commercial lake fisheries who have self contained lakes reserved for fishing only, that are satisfied there is minimal risk of spreading the parasites to their own stock, and undertake that the fish will never be moved elsewhere, they should be allowed to take the surplus fish into their lake. The solution to the anglers concerns would then lie in the hands of other anglers and the rest of the world could get on with their lives in peace while the anglers sorted it out amongst themselves. If they are right they will gain some free "stock". If they are wrong their "good stock" will be contaminated by the "bad stock" and they will learn to be more careful next time.

Mark Dixon
Posts: 820
Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:22 am
Location: Devon
Has thanked: 1 time

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Mark Dixon »

When I had a lot more time on my hands I done quite a bit of carp fishing, many fisheries will have holding ponds where fish can be treated if they have problems, I'm not sure on todays laws but they probably need to have a fair bit of paperwork from the EA before any moves take place in case of spread of disease, nets and boots should always be disinfected after use before visiting a different fishery. It sounds like the lake does not have a very good balance of species if there are problems and that should be looked at and probably remove some fish.
I am interested in the fact that their waste is a health hazard as the Kennick Resevoir on Dartmoor is full of carp and thats our drinking water, I assume SWW don't have problems?
Coarse fisherman have always been pretty amicable with other river/lake users in my experience (has that changed??)
Mark

User avatar
Strad
Posts: 1913
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:27 am
Location: The Beautiful Borders of Scotland
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 5 times
Contact:

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Strad »

Weren't carp bred for food for many hundreds of years - so long as the parasites involved aren't harmful to humans why not just allow a catch and cook policy for 6 months.

As for the arguments between anglers and swimmers, it really just go to show the attitude that anglers have with respect to anyone else's sports if they think it impacts theirs. Ridiculous situation, as stated, just remove the fishing rights granted.
Old School?? I miss my AQII..
Graham Stradling

User avatar
Wildswimmer Pete
Posts: 1324
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Runcorn New Town
Has thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Wildswimmer Pete »

Mark Dixon wrote: I am interested in the fact that their waste is a health hazard as the Kennick Resevoir on Dartmoor is full of carp and thats our drinking water, I assume SWW don't have problems?
But the water drawn from the reservoir is filtered and chlorinated before it comes out your taps. Henleaze Lake is a very small artificial lake and is quite literally an overgrown swimming pool. All animals defecate and their poo can contain human pathogens. Now fish poo in a flowing river doesn't normally result a health hazard to humans, but we're talking about a small, enclosed ecosystem that's become seriously out of balance. As the lake is used for swimming the swimming club have to abide with EU bathing water requirements, including coliform counts together with those of other human pathogens. Hence the cull.

One angler was banging on about "the water being crystal clear". Most of the open water I swim in (usually the River Weaver) is far from crystal clear - it's always murky. I've never caught anything from the Weaver despite swimming in it for over 35 years. On the other hand there have been instances of multiple cases of cryptosporidiosis caught from the "sparkling water" of a public swimming pool. Crypto is highly resistant to chlorine and can be a serious health hazard should it find its way into swimming pools and public water supplies. Henleaze Lake is only used by the members of the private swimming club so there won't be any problems caused by the users fouling the water.

Wildswimmer Pete
Nili illegitimi carborundum

Mark Dixon
Posts: 820
Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:22 am
Location: Devon
Has thanked: 1 time

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Mark Dixon »

Wildswimmer Pete wrote:
Mark Dixon wrote: I am interested in the fact that their waste is a health hazard as the Kennick Resevoir on Dartmoor is full of carp and thats our drinking water, I assume SWW don't have problems?
But the water drawn from the reservoir is filtered and chlorinated before it comes out your taps. Henleaze Lake is a very small artificial lake and is quite literally an overgrown swimming pool. All animals defecate and their poo can contain human pathogens. Now fish poo in a flowing river doesn't normally result a health hazard to humans, but we're talking about a small, enclosed ecosystem that's become seriously out of balance. As the lake is used for swimming the swimming club have to abide with EU bathing water requirements, including coliform counts together with those of other human pathogens. Hence the cull.

One angler was banging on about "the water being crystal clear". Most of the open water I swim in (usually the River Weaver) is far from crystal clear - it's always murky. I've never caught anything from the Weaver despite swimming in it for over 35 years. On the other hand there have been instances of multiple cases of cryptosporidiosis caught from the "sparkling water" of a public swimming pool. Crypto is highly resistant to chlorine and can be a serious health hazard should it find its way into swimming pools and public water supplies. Henleaze Lake is only used by the members of the private swimming club so there won't be any problems caused by the users fouling the water.

Wildswimmer Pete
Well if its only a small lake then the fish need to be moved rather than culled, I got involved with similar when Paignton Zoo sold land off to build a Morrisons store, we caught many fish and they were moved to a couple locations, one of those is still thriving now as a business employing local people, it was eventually filled in and netted to remove the remaining fish.
I am sure if its only a small lake they can successfully be netted and moved on without the need to cull, might even create jobs in future?
Many of the carp in Kennick resevoir were caught and sent to different parts of Devons SWW Resevoirs under watchful eye of EA and still bring in tourists to the area and local jobs.
In Australia it is a criminal offence to release a carp back into the river as they stir up the bottom stopping some plant life survive, they were introduced for food here in Middle Ages but only Eastern Europeans eat them as a delicacy in modern Europe. I cant imagine they taste that nice eating at the lake bottom all time.

User avatar
Wildswimmer Pete
Posts: 1324
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Runcorn New Town
Has thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Wildswimmer Pete »

Mark Dixon wrote: Well if its only a small lake then the fish need to be moved rather than culled, I got involved with similar when Paignton Zoo sold land off to build a Morrisons store, we caught many fish and they were moved to a couple locations, one of those is still thriving now as a business employing local people, it was eventually filled in and netted to remove the remaining fish.
I am sure if its only a small lake they can successfully be netted and moved on without the need to cull, might even create jobs in future?
Should you listen to above-mentioned segment, the cull is regarded essential because the carp in question are allegedly infected with a parasite.

Wildswimmer Pete
Nili illegitimi carborundum

Mark Dixon
Posts: 820
Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:22 am
Location: Devon
Has thanked: 1 time

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Mark Dixon »

Pete thats normal for carp to be infected with parasites, we used to have some disenfectant or other to use every time a carp was caught due to parasites, its not a good enough reason to cull unless the EA authorize it.
Sorry I dont like Jeremy Vine so wont be listening to it.
Mark

User avatar
Chalky723
Posts: 935
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:56 pm
Location: Cambridgeshire
Has thanked: 19 times
Been thanked: 12 times

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Chalky723 »

Mark Dixon wrote:Pete thats normal for carp to be infected with parasites, we used to have some disenfectant or other to use every time a carp was caught due to parasites, its not a good enough reason to cull unless the EA authorize it.
Sorry I dont like Jeremy Vine so wont be listening to it.
Mark
According to the chap doing the culling, it had been authorised. To transfer them to another water with the alien parasite would have been a criminal offence.

At the end of the day, it's a swimming lake artificially stocked with fish. They're reducing the numbers, not eradicating them. Should make the fishing a bit more of a challenge to be honest.

C
Jackson Nirvana, Gumotex Palava 400

Kayacb
Posts: 720
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:22 am
Location: Sherwood Forest

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Kayacb »

I like the last guy on the piece, he spoke a lot of sense!

User avatar
Wildswimmer Pete
Posts: 1324
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 10:07 pm
Location: Runcorn New Town
Has thanked: 1 time
Contact:

Re: "Anglers have arguments with everyone"

Post by Wildswimmer Pete »

Chalky723 wrote: For the record I'm a "casual" coarse, game & sea fisherman myself, as well as a kayaker, but have no time for this continual lack of a will to share the natural resources of the land....

C
I've come across many decent anglers. In fact most of my interactions with anglers have been in Scotland, who are paying a small fortune to fish for salmon. Never had any problems when swimming in Scottish waters. In fact when I was swimming in the Annan at Hoddom Castle (nr. Locherbie) a salmon angler on the far bank asked me to swim to the centre of the river to attract fish towards him. We were bellowing at each other over the roar of the river in full spate but my tether is only 30 metres so couldn't make it to mid-river. Another angler on my bank asked me how I swam without a wetsuit (it was a February and water temp. 6C) and no sign of shivering nor sign any other distress. We then had a bit of a chat about the cold-hardening training that I undertook. I was there for about an hour and there was no problem with me being present there.

Wildswimmer Pete
Nili illegitimi carborundum

Post Reply

Return to “Whitewater and Touring”