the One Show tonight

[Keith Day]

I understand there may be some river access content on the one show at 7.00 p.m. tonight

[icklepaddler]

Can't believe that the BCU turned down an offer to appear on national media.

Pathetic.

Comment on Facebook me thinks.

[DaveBland]

Hang on... so there was a feature on National TV specifically about access issues with paddlers and the BCU were asked to be involved but declined?

[Sorry I'm in Canadia so obviously missed it.]

If that's right, it's beyond incredible.

[icklepaddler]

Yep.

According to their fb page their legal team advised them not to post due to the possibility of AT's pending legal action.

They need to grow a pair and represent their members.

[icklepaddler]

I sometimes wonder if;

1) the BCU care about non competitive members or anything other than measuring increased participation to ensure funding comes in

Or more worryingly

2) they dont believe Caffyn

[SimonMW]

It's a pretty poor show that they were advised not to go on. However, it sounds like Caffyn gave a good showing, and from what I hear the AT bloke was made to look more like selfish fool by the presenters.

I think that in some respects the BCU not going on was a good idea, because Caffyn is an independent and a scholar, so putting up his knowledge against an oaf from the AT rather than clouding the argument with a BCU representative was probably best.

[Keith Day]

For those that missed the One Show, It's here.

It starts at about 8 mins 30 secs

[Mark Dixon]

I think the BCU are right to not comment, the media twist things, especially in interviews, seems to me it will go to court as BCU not backing down. The Lawyers will be giving the interviews until its sorted either way.
Mark

[SimonMW]

I've just watched the segment. Shows how pathetic the AT are that they refused to take part in the programme if the presenter was shown in a boat on the river!

Also loved how they played the banjo tune from Deliverance over the top of Mark Lloyd. Very apt...

[tuesdaygreen]

It's a structural failure of the BCU and the AT that negotiations haven't avoided this nonsense. At the end of the day most paddlers and fishermen alike, while having very different perceptions, have the same goals at heart; the protection and enjoyment of the great outdoors. Only empathy and talking can create better relations, not silence and lawyers.

[Keith Day]

I think the BCU are right to not comment, ..

They did comment, just not off the cuff on camera. Their comment was read out at the end. Something like "We have tried over many years to establish a working relationship with the Angling Trust so that both sports can be enjoyed and shared by everyone"

[Mark R]

Pretty good little segment, I thought. It went as far as the non-partisan BBC can go, in showing the AT to have their heads up their backsides.

Main shame was that they presented the Access issue as a fairly recent one, seeming to imply that the AT's recent sulk was the beginning and end of what we know is a very long story.

[Big Henry]

At the end of the day most paddlers and fishermen alike, while having very different perceptions, have the same goals at heart; the protection and enjoyment of the great outdoors.

Disagree, to a point. Most fishermen, maybe, but the vociferous minority that rule the likes of the AT want the protection and enjoyment of the great outdoors exclusively for themselves, whilst paddlers want the protection and enjoyment of the great outdoors for everyone.

[Big Henry]

Just watched the clip, and I was reasonably impressed with how it was reported, with the exception of the time frame being described as only 2 years, which Matt Baker said the BCU has been trying over "many years" to sort it. And I like that the reporter said the "Angling Association said they would refuse to take part if I was seen on a waterway" - how petty did that make them seem!

Also - I've never seen anyone "clad in lycra on plastic boats" while I've been paddling!

Is there anyone who follows the angling forums know what they thought of it?

[Chas C]

Interesting to see that they AT were suggesting two seasons, summer fishing and winter paddling. This is a move I'd not seen before ? but not helpful to those who want to tour.

[StoneWeasel]

...you need permission to navigate down non-navigable rivers

Brilliant! I hope this is the basis for their legal arguments. While we are at it I really do not mind seeking permission for driving down impassible roads or climbing unclimbable cliffs.

[Wildswimmer Pete]

I've never seen anyone "clad in lycra on plastic boats" while I've been paddling!

Well, I wear spandex (near relative of lycra) in rivers. ;-)

I don't have TV but I watched the piece via iPlayer catch-up. I thought it quite well balanced, I really liked the clip of Doug Caffyn telling it as it is, while the Angling Dude just waffled about "expert opinion" - which experts? Fish Legal's "experts"?

Pretty good little segment, I thought. It went as far as the non-partisan BBC can go, in showing the AT to have their heads up their backsides.

Amen to that.

Could someone post a clip of that segment on YouTube?

Looks like we're still in for the long haul.

Wildswimmer Pete

[MikeVeal]

Interesting to see that they AT were suggesting two seasons, summer fishing and winter paddling. This is a move I'd not seen before ? but not helpful to those who want to tour.

Desperate attempt to sound reasonable?
I bet if pressed, that will be on one god forsaken ditch in the centre of Birmingham and the status quo for all other rivers is: "Git orf the water that isn't mine that flows over the land that I'd find it extremely difficult to prove I own. You've got no right(to spoil my fishing), grrrrrrrrrr."

Edit to add: I sometimes wonder if the AT are waiting for Doug C to pop off before they make a legal move. May he see many more seasons in good health.

[Wildswimmer Pete]

showing the AT to have their heads up their backsides.

Like this? :-)



Wildswimmer Pete

[Franky]

Interesting to see that they AT were suggesting two seasons, summer fishing and winter paddling. This is a move I'd not seen before ? but not helpful to those who want to tour.

Desperate attempt to sound reasonable?

Reasonable? What would the anglers be giving up, since (I assume, I know nothing about fishing) they wouldn't be fishing in the winter anyway?!

Meanwhile, everybody who prefers paddling in the summer to the winter (most non-WW paddlers and probably a lot of WW paddlers too?) would be shooting themselves in the foot to agree to those conditions, which could be cited in any dispute even though they're not legally binding.

[MikeVeal]

Interesting to see that they AT were suggesting two seasons, summer fishing and winter paddling. This is a move I'd not seen before ? but not helpful to those who want to tour.

Desperate attempt to sound reasonable?

Reasonable? What would the anglers be giving up, since (I assume, I know nothing about fishing) they wouldn't be fishing in the winter anyway?!

Meanwhile, everybody who prefers paddling in the summer to the winter (most non-WW paddlers and probably a lot of WW paddlers too?) would be shooting themselves in the foot to agree to those conditions, which could be cited in any dispute even though they're not legally binding.

Agreed, I don't think it's reasonable at all. I said it was an attempt to *sound* reasonable.

[Pat R]

Mark Lloyd of the Angling Trust comments on the interview. The BCU's solicitors have responded.

http://www.fishingmagic.com/forums/gene ... ost1314271

As usual with the media, 3 hours of filming were edited into a short clip and some of my comments were reported out of context. What they asked me was "when would you let canoes onto rivers?" I replied that "all rivers are different and it depends whether it is a coarse fishing or game fishing river, or both". They then asked "what about on this river?" (we were filming on the River Exe, which they had decided in advance) and I replied "on this river, which is a game fishing river, canoeing could be allowed in the winter when people aren't fishing" (or words to that effect). They cut out the bit about it being river-specific.
It is important to stress that any access to rivers by canoes must be agreed on a river-by-river basis by the landowners and angling clubs concerned, to reflect the local fishing seasons and to protect fish and fishing.
This kind of misrepresentation is very common in the media. Every piece I see covered on the news on subjects where I have some expertise fails to tell the story accurately.
What is important is that the Angling Trust & Fish Legal are actually taking on this issue. We have spent several months worth of staff time dealing with local and national problems with canoes and we are making real progress.
Our legal case continues, we are just working through a 14 page response from the BCU's solicitors.
Anyone wishing to support our efforts would be welcome to join us at Angling Trust Organisation for Anglers. Please also support us by taking part in our raffle at The Angling Trust 2014 Raffle | Enter for your chance to win up to £5,000 cash or £2,000 Daiwa tackle
All best wishes
Mark
Mark Lloyd, Chief Executive, Angling Trust & Fish Legal.

[Wildswimmer Pete]

Please also support us by taking part in our raffle at The Angling Trust 2014 Raffle. Enter for your chance to win up to £5,000 cash or £2,000 Daiwa tackle

whinge Angling Trust and Fish Legal, they obviously aren't as wealthy and powerful as they lead us to believe.

Yes, they've had to dig out out the begging bowl.

Wildswimmer Pete

[icklepaddler]

Seeing as this was one of the highest profile slots the access issue has received in years*, where were our Olympic medallists?

Cycling can mobilise their stars to fight the cause for safer routes etc, but we cannot get our "paid" stars out there fronting the campaign? Why is that? Why can we not make the best use of these people whom we have funded / helped train etc etc?

* = if the one show is the highest profile media exposure in years then god help us. Whomever the BCU / CE media manager is really needs sacking or alternatively they should resign for not being allowed to perform their job.

[TechnoEngineer]

Mark Lloyd of the Angling Trust comments on the interview. The BCU's solicitors have responded.

http://www.fishingmagic.com/forums/gene ... ost1314271

As usual with the media, 3 hours of filming were edited into a short clip and some of my comments were reported out of context. What they asked me was "when would you let canoes onto rivers?" I replied that "all rivers are different and it depends whether it is a coarse fishing or game fishing river, or both". They then asked "what about on this river?" (we were filming on the River Exe, which they had decided in advance) and I replied "on this river, which is a game fishing river, canoeing could be allowed in the winter when people aren't fishing" (or words to that effect). They cut out the bit about it being river-specific.
It is important to stress that any access to rivers by canoes must be agreed on a river-by-river basis by the landowners and angling clubs concerned, to reflect the local fishing seasons and to protect fish and fishing.
This kind of misrepresentation is very common in the media. Every piece I see covered on the news on subjects where I have some expertise fails to tell the story accurately.
What is important is that the Angling Trust & Fish Legal are actually taking on this issue. We have spent several months worth of staff time dealing with local and national problems with canoes and we are making real progress.
Our legal case continues, we are just working through a 14 page response from the BCU's solicitors.
Anyone wishing to support our efforts would be welcome to join us at Angling Trust Organisation for Anglers. Please also support us by taking part in our raffle at The Angling Trust 2014 Raffle | Enter for your chance to win up to £5,000 cash or £2,000 Daiwa tackle
All best wishes
Mark
Mark Lloyd, Chief Executive, Angling Trust & Fish Legal.

And that, boys and girls, is part of what we're paying the BCU for. They are pulling their finger out on the access issue, no?

[icklepaddler]

Mark Lloyd of the Angling Trust comments on the interview. The BCU's solicitors have responded.

http://www.fishingmagic.com/forums/gene ... ost1314271

Our legal case continues, we are just working through a 14 page response from the BCU's solicitors.

All best wishes
Mark
Mark Lloyd, Chief Executive, Angling Trust & Fish Legal.

And that, boys and girls, is part of what we're paying the BCU for. They are pulling their finger out on the access issue, no?

It wouldn't surprise me if its 14 pages of BCU rebuttal to the claim that they are encouraging members to paddle.

[forestcreature]

This may be irrelevant or counterproductive, but the idea of protecting fish by sticking sharp things in them is laughable.

[dougdew99]

I have seen no evidence that BCU is actively engaged in any Access Campaigning activities at all... I would be very glad to be proved wrong... My guess is that the 14 pages were written by their lawyers strictly in rebuttal of the accusations made by Anglers Trust... Two organizations, largely irrelevant to the communities that they claim to represent, engaged in impotent grandstanding... Thank God for the few who continue the struggle for our rights...

[flipt]

I feel inclined to agree.
Today i made a big move against my normal view however and joined Canoe Wales. I dont like a lot of what they do, but i do take the view that they are the best we have and by being a member i may be able to add some input. I could be wrong, but i cant whine about them if i dont get involved first. Its been over a decade since i was last a member and a lot has changed in that time!