Having been a climber/hill walker since I was a lad, I've done my fair share of drinking untreated water from remote streams - always above human habitation and having a cursory check a few metres up-stream for the dead or dying sheep. I can't recall having any problems - 'til a while back when adventure racing in very hot conditions in Wales. Necessity forced three of us to drink from a fairly sluggish source - abeit high up. We were all subsequently poorly with typical abdominal upset symptoms.
You can't move in outdoor shops these days for filtration systems and chemical additives to make stream water "safe" - but is this just another gimmicky way of getting folk to part with cash for fear of such beasties as campylobacter, cryptosporidium and e-coli ... not to mention giardia.
Bar and I tend to carry some drinking water in to wildcamps but for cooking and brews, tend to bring stream water to the boil and leave it bubbling for two minutes at last to hopefully kill off anything nasty. Is this enough?
What do others do?
Are there those who wouldn't touch a drop without iodine or chorine treatments or those who drink anything, anywhere, anytime? (Outside the bar, of course!)
Anyone know just what the risks are and has anyone had problems drinking water from remote sources?
Cheers
Chris
Wild camping and drinking water
23 posts
• Page 1 of 1
Wild camping and drinking water
by Bruxy » Thu Aug 31, 2006 4:10 pm
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Bruxy - Posts: 114
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by tpage » Thu Aug 31, 2006 5:05 pm
Boiling is the way to go- if you can spare the fuel.
Otherwise get yourself a decent filtre- between 0.22-0.4 µm if possible.
I wouldnt trust any untreated water- even in the Scotttish wilderness!
Tony
Otherwise get yourself a decent filtre- between 0.22-0.4 µm if possible.
I wouldnt trust any untreated water- even in the Scotttish wilderness!
Tony
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tpage - Posts: 454
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by Simon Willis » Thu Aug 31, 2006 5:18 pm
We've never been out for more than 2 nights from a sea-kayak so we carry water with us in a couple of MSR Dromedaries.
In UK mountains I do the same as you, take water from high up. I would not drink untreated water from a sea-level stream.
For five months on the Pacific Crest Trail in the US our fuel was precious and hard to come by so we "purified" clean water with Aqua Mira which is chlorine dioxide (NOT regular chlorine treatment).
In the Sierra we carried Polar Pure Iodine for a change, but quickly went back to Aqua Mira - the above link explains why it's preferable.
In desert areas, where we occasionally had to draw from visibly dirty water (thankfully rare), we used a 1ltr Safewater Anywhere Expedition bottle but the company has gone out of business. Filter bottles are usually lighter than filter systems as there's no pump mechanism, you suck or squeeze the water through, but much slower so useful as a back-up.
S
In UK mountains I do the same as you, take water from high up. I would not drink untreated water from a sea-level stream.
For five months on the Pacific Crest Trail in the US our fuel was precious and hard to come by so we "purified" clean water with Aqua Mira which is chlorine dioxide (NOT regular chlorine treatment).
In the Sierra we carried Polar Pure Iodine for a change, but quickly went back to Aqua Mira - the above link explains why it's preferable.
In desert areas, where we occasionally had to draw from visibly dirty water (thankfully rare), we used a 1ltr Safewater Anywhere Expedition bottle but the company has gone out of business. Filter bottles are usually lighter than filter systems as there's no pump mechanism, you suck or squeeze the water through, but much slower so useful as a back-up.
S
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by Skerryvore » Thu Aug 31, 2006 8:26 pm
On a trip to Ailsa Craig this summer we were warned not to drink from the stream as many Gannets fly over to the mainland & feed on the landfill sites & you could catch Botulism.
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by glupton » Thu Aug 31, 2006 9:09 pm
I must admit that I have no qualms about drinking any freshwater that I find. As long as it doesn't look,smell or taste dodgy have a dead sheep a few metres up stream etc., I'll use it. I never have any problems.
I have been doing this for a lot of years and I reckon it is probably one of the reasons why I have a strong immune system.
I have been doing this for a lot of years and I reckon it is probably one of the reasons why I have a strong immune system.
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glupton - Posts: 502
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by Jim » Thu Aug 31, 2006 9:28 pm
Purifying tablets and filters tend to deal with different nasties to some extent - i.e. some are killed by one and not the other. Boiling does work (I'm not sure how wide a spectrum of diseases it deals with) but apparantly should be more than just bringing to the boil - I think it is supposed to boil for 20 mins, which is OK for cooking but a pain for making tea.
All of which said I generally replenish with stream water, add puritabs and then reserve it for anything that requires boiling (i.e. making tea) although I rarely boil it for long enough to be effective. I can't recall getting ill doing this, but then maybe I've been lucky not to collect any contaminated water yet.... After the Grand Canyon I was considering getting a filter, but I think before spending it's worth researching which diseases they are effective for and if you are likely to encounter them - I mean there is no point using a system designed to filter African diseases on the west coast of Scotland if it has a completely different population of diseases.....
Jim
All of which said I generally replenish with stream water, add puritabs and then reserve it for anything that requires boiling (i.e. making tea) although I rarely boil it for long enough to be effective. I can't recall getting ill doing this, but then maybe I've been lucky not to collect any contaminated water yet.... After the Grand Canyon I was considering getting a filter, but I think before spending it's worth researching which diseases they are effective for and if you are likely to encounter them - I mean there is no point using a system designed to filter African diseases on the west coast of Scotland if it has a completely different population of diseases.....
Jim
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by Owen » Thu Aug 31, 2006 10:17 pm
The only filter I've used is the Katadyn system, very effective but hugely expensive (~£200). MSR make a similar looking one but with a lower pumping rate for £80 from cotswold camping maybe cheeper elsewhere. I've no idea how effective they are at getting rid of nasties.
I got the Katadyn filter for an expedition to the Andies it didn't like glacier silt as I remember. I no longer have it and in the uk generally try and take plenty of water with me. I take every opportunity to fill up from any taps along the way but sometimes you just have to take from streams and boil it. I've never had any trouble here in Britian unlike in other parts of the world.
I got the Katadyn filter for an expedition to the Andies it didn't like glacier silt as I remember. I no longer have it and in the uk generally try and take plenty of water with me. I take every opportunity to fill up from any taps along the way but sometimes you just have to take from streams and boil it. I've never had any trouble here in Britian unlike in other parts of the world.
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by PeterG » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:06 pm
Wales and the lakes are dodgy due to the livestock, however, most of the scottish highlands appear safe, I drink the water everywhere with no ill effects. Why should a stream running into the sea be more dangerous than the water 1000m higher with no people or livestock in between? Dead deer impart flavour but no pathogens, though the tufts of hair clog your teapot.
On the long paddle down to Oban bothy at the end of Loch Morar I just carry a plastic mug in the decklines and drink straight from the loch as I paddle, no ill effects.
Tea in Africa or Asia is invariably safe even when made at 3000m plus in lukewarm boiling water, so a few moments boiling must be enough. The only exclusions being glacial melt water or water from muddy creeks where it may be the physical irritation from the particles that gives the problems.
On the other hand after being away for a few weeks the tap water here in Hampshire always gives me 48 hours of mild stomach upset (and dandruf to boot the first time I shower in it).
Peter
On the long paddle down to Oban bothy at the end of Loch Morar I just carry a plastic mug in the decklines and drink straight from the loch as I paddle, no ill effects.
Tea in Africa or Asia is invariably safe even when made at 3000m plus in lukewarm boiling water, so a few moments boiling must be enough. The only exclusions being glacial melt water or water from muddy creeks where it may be the physical irritation from the particles that gives the problems.
On the other hand after being away for a few weeks the tap water here in Hampshire always gives me 48 hours of mild stomach upset (and dandruf to boot the first time I shower in it).
Peter
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by kierandokane » Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:33 am
This has been pasted from Brandon and Heather Nelson's Blog that can be found at:
http://mountainzone.com/wetdawg_blogs/seakayaking_blog/
He picked up this nasty bug during the Yukon River Quest, I guess if you can pick something like this up in that king of wilderness it can happen anywhere. After reading this I'll not be drinking untreated water any time soon! I carry two Camelbak bladders with me.... that way I can drink from one while the other water is being treated.
K.
"Despite that lesson over a decade ago, I made a similarly stupid mistake on the Yukon this year. We didn't want to carry the extra weight of full hydration bladders for the longer first and second legs of the race. Instead, we agreed, we'd go with 100 ounce bladders and refill from the river and Lake LaBerge as we raced. The large, threaded opening on the CamelBak bladders make them very quick to refill. I'd briefly stick the opened bladder under the way, and it would surge itself full. Before I put the cap back on, I'd pour in a healthy dose of Gatorade powder from a large-mouth bottle I kept in my deck bag, cap it, give it a shake and be back to racing. It didn't take me a minute to complete the whole refill process.
This speed of getting back to paddling is where races are won and lost. When your partner is up over 200 lbs and he stops paddling to eat, medicate, or refill a bladder, your're working HARD (and using up valuable energy) to keep the tandem moving at a decent clip. In a race, even a days-long ultra, your mind is programmed to remember that 'Every Second Counts.' For that very reason, and since I hadn't seen any cattle ranches since I'd pulled into Whitehorse, I decided to go without filtering or even iodine. Over the course of 40 hours on the river, I took in no less than 12 gallons of pure, un-cut, Yukon River swill.
It took about two weeks for the microbial monsters in my guts to really start making trouble, and they timed their debut perfectly with my brother's wedding. As I stood by my bro's side as his best man, I strained to keep my sphincter clamped shut, and to take slow, deep breaths to keep from blowing chunks into the seated crowd. That was merely the start of what has been a two-week gastrointestinal nightmare... all for a few saved seconds on a race we won by over two hours. I'm a few doses into the drugs to knock it out now, but I'm not home free yet.
The Yukon hydration blunder was my proverbial 'hastily stowed kayak'. I chose race-pace reflex over what, in restrospect, is simple common sense. It was some seriously bad judgement. But no untreated water will pass by these lips again. And the irony of it, undoubtedly, is that the extra act of care in the next race will lead to a faster net finish time.
--Signing off from the porcelain throne, still down 12 pounds from normal, 'Sir Squirts-A-Lot'..."
http://mountainzone.com/wetdawg_blogs/seakayaking_blog/
He picked up this nasty bug during the Yukon River Quest, I guess if you can pick something like this up in that king of wilderness it can happen anywhere. After reading this I'll not be drinking untreated water any time soon! I carry two Camelbak bladders with me.... that way I can drink from one while the other water is being treated.
K.
"Despite that lesson over a decade ago, I made a similarly stupid mistake on the Yukon this year. We didn't want to carry the extra weight of full hydration bladders for the longer first and second legs of the race. Instead, we agreed, we'd go with 100 ounce bladders and refill from the river and Lake LaBerge as we raced. The large, threaded opening on the CamelBak bladders make them very quick to refill. I'd briefly stick the opened bladder under the way, and it would surge itself full. Before I put the cap back on, I'd pour in a healthy dose of Gatorade powder from a large-mouth bottle I kept in my deck bag, cap it, give it a shake and be back to racing. It didn't take me a minute to complete the whole refill process.
This speed of getting back to paddling is where races are won and lost. When your partner is up over 200 lbs and he stops paddling to eat, medicate, or refill a bladder, your're working HARD (and using up valuable energy) to keep the tandem moving at a decent clip. In a race, even a days-long ultra, your mind is programmed to remember that 'Every Second Counts.' For that very reason, and since I hadn't seen any cattle ranches since I'd pulled into Whitehorse, I decided to go without filtering or even iodine. Over the course of 40 hours on the river, I took in no less than 12 gallons of pure, un-cut, Yukon River swill.
It took about two weeks for the microbial monsters in my guts to really start making trouble, and they timed their debut perfectly with my brother's wedding. As I stood by my bro's side as his best man, I strained to keep my sphincter clamped shut, and to take slow, deep breaths to keep from blowing chunks into the seated crowd. That was merely the start of what has been a two-week gastrointestinal nightmare... all for a few saved seconds on a race we won by over two hours. I'm a few doses into the drugs to knock it out now, but I'm not home free yet.
The Yukon hydration blunder was my proverbial 'hastily stowed kayak'. I chose race-pace reflex over what, in restrospect, is simple common sense. It was some seriously bad judgement. But no untreated water will pass by these lips again. And the irony of it, undoubtedly, is that the extra act of care in the next race will lead to a faster net finish time.
--Signing off from the porcelain throne, still down 12 pounds from normal, 'Sir Squirts-A-Lot'..."
- kierandokane
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by Bruxy » Tue Sep 12, 2006 11:56 am
Interesting reading what folk do .. or don't do .. to their water prior to drinking and the mixed approach.
I too subscribed heavily to the school of thought that drinking untreated water from above human habitation was fine as, after all, I'd been doing it happily for 30+ years with only one or two problems - the latter one being the most distressing in that I felt pretty grim for three or four days and would have been more than pleased to die in my sleep!
Fortunately, I was back at home where the subsequent dependence on the loo was more an amusement for friends and family than a holiday-wrecker. I can't bring myself to imagine the consequences of feeling that bad a few days into a 10 day paddling trip !!!
Having had chance to investigate a few web-sites on the topic, it seems that, even on the more scientific (non-commercial) sites, there's still considerable variation into what you have to do to get "safe" drinking water.
The consensus (for the UK at any rate) is that boiling for AT LEAST 2 MINUTES at sea level would kill most organisms that would cause problems. I say "most" as there would seem to be viruses and cysts that can survive this treatment - BUT you have to weigh up the likelihood of them being present and, if ingested, actually causing harm.
As I say, there's a lot of variation and I'm no expert, but considering my own experiences over time - I'll not be spending my money on filters, Iodine/Chlorine tabs or systems that seem to rely on some flavour of electrolysis - but will carry a little more fuel and boil any water collected in the field.
Good excuse for stopping for frequent cups of tea !!!
Cheers
Chris
As an aside, it was interesting to read on the various websites that many considered springs to be a good and reliable source of unpolluted water.
As a potholer, I'd say this was definitely not always the case ... in limestone areas, streams sink and then resurge; sometimes a considerable way away and sometimes a matter of a few metres away depending on the geology.
For water that's been slow flowing and filtering through silts etc underground, I would say that many organic impurities would be removed and the resulting springs relatively clean.
In other cases where the time underground is short and the flow rapid, the water is going to emerge just as grubby as it sank.
We were caving at the weekend (well above human habitation in the Yorkshire Dales)and "enjoyed" the experience of having to clamber around the carcass of a decaying sheep that had fallen into the hole and then been washed some distance down the stream passage. Not sure I'd be rushing to drink deeply from the resurgence just down the valley !!
I too subscribed heavily to the school of thought that drinking untreated water from above human habitation was fine as, after all, I'd been doing it happily for 30+ years with only one or two problems - the latter one being the most distressing in that I felt pretty grim for three or four days and would have been more than pleased to die in my sleep!
Fortunately, I was back at home where the subsequent dependence on the loo was more an amusement for friends and family than a holiday-wrecker. I can't bring myself to imagine the consequences of feeling that bad a few days into a 10 day paddling trip !!!
Having had chance to investigate a few web-sites on the topic, it seems that, even on the more scientific (non-commercial) sites, there's still considerable variation into what you have to do to get "safe" drinking water.
The consensus (for the UK at any rate) is that boiling for AT LEAST 2 MINUTES at sea level would kill most organisms that would cause problems. I say "most" as there would seem to be viruses and cysts that can survive this treatment - BUT you have to weigh up the likelihood of them being present and, if ingested, actually causing harm.
As I say, there's a lot of variation and I'm no expert, but considering my own experiences over time - I'll not be spending my money on filters, Iodine/Chlorine tabs or systems that seem to rely on some flavour of electrolysis - but will carry a little more fuel and boil any water collected in the field.
Good excuse for stopping for frequent cups of tea !!!
Cheers
Chris
As an aside, it was interesting to read on the various websites that many considered springs to be a good and reliable source of unpolluted water.
As a potholer, I'd say this was definitely not always the case ... in limestone areas, streams sink and then resurge; sometimes a considerable way away and sometimes a matter of a few metres away depending on the geology.
For water that's been slow flowing and filtering through silts etc underground, I would say that many organic impurities would be removed and the resulting springs relatively clean.
In other cases where the time underground is short and the flow rapid, the water is going to emerge just as grubby as it sank.
We were caving at the weekend (well above human habitation in the Yorkshire Dales)and "enjoyed" the experience of having to clamber around the carcass of a decaying sheep that had fallen into the hole and then been washed some distance down the stream passage. Not sure I'd be rushing to drink deeply from the resurgence just down the valley !!
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by adrian j pullin » Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:48 pm
I recall staying at the lighthouse at Rubha Reidh a few years ago. The water from their taps was about the colour of a pale ale but was perfectly drinkable. It was " filtered through layers of peat". Didn't taste like Pale Ale but tasted fine, certainly better than the chlorine laden muck the United Utilities pipe to us.
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adrian j pullin - Posts: 1345
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by Jim » Tue Sep 12, 2006 1:02 pm
adrian j pullin wrote:I recall staying at the lighthouse at Rubha Reidh a few years ago. The water from their taps was about the colour of a pale ale but was perfectly drinkable. It was " filtered through layers of peat". Didn't taste like Pale Ale but tasted fine, certainly better than the chlorine laden muck the United Utilities pipe to us.
It is quite common for the tap water in remote areas of Scotland to be this colour (far too much peat solids for effective filtration, i.e. the filters would last 5 minutes). Whilst it may be totally disease free, I understand that it is not necessarily safe to non locals and that the peat content can in fact cause liver problems (maybe it's kidneys since they are the bodies filters) in people not used to drinking it. I think you would be alright for a holiday, it is a chronic problem. I should probably check this out properly if my folks are serious about moving to somewhere remote!
Jim
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by adrian j pullin » Tue Sep 12, 2006 1:07 pm
OK. Similar to the water on lanzarote, which is ok for locals but has too high a salt content if you are not used to it.
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Pre-Mac
by Slaphappy » Tue Sep 12, 2006 1:11 pm
Hi,
I Use the Pre-Mac you can use it on the fly as and when needed, there are two options the travel well and pocket. These are aproved for use by the military and charities working in bad water areas. The pocket will fit in the front of your boyancy aid. http://www.pre-mac.com/ most outdoor shops sell them look out for ray mears's mug on the packaging.
This is the best and most portable system I have found to date, clean mug of water in 2mins, small light weight and takes a knock as well.
The two you are interested in are the trekker and pocket, obviously no good for sea water. in my opinion best bet is always to boil and filter through a high grade millbank, but in the UK Pre-Mac should be enough.
Drinking untreated water is ok so long and you are 100% sure it is from the source and you have traced the route, snow rain water should be treated. In an emergancy, who cares water will keep you alive and you can worry about the bugs later.
Cheers
Jez
I Use the Pre-Mac you can use it on the fly as and when needed, there are two options the travel well and pocket. These are aproved for use by the military and charities working in bad water areas. The pocket will fit in the front of your boyancy aid. http://www.pre-mac.com/ most outdoor shops sell them look out for ray mears's mug on the packaging.
This is the best and most portable system I have found to date, clean mug of water in 2mins, small light weight and takes a knock as well.
The two you are interested in are the trekker and pocket, obviously no good for sea water. in my opinion best bet is always to boil and filter through a high grade millbank, but in the UK Pre-Mac should be enough.
Drinking untreated water is ok so long and you are 100% sure it is from the source and you have traced the route, snow rain water should be treated. In an emergancy, who cares water will keep you alive and you can worry about the bugs later.
Cheers
Jez
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Slaphappy - Posts: 303
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by Bruxy » Tue Sep 12, 2006 2:47 pm
Hi Jez,
Probably me, but I'm not sure I quite understand what you're saying ... it's difficult if not impossible to be 100% sure of the source - that's what makes the issue of whether to drink without treatment or not questionable.
I can't imagine any source of water not being fed essentially by rain or snow - and the longer it's collecting on the ground, the more likely it is to pick up organisms/minerals that could cause problems. I would have thought that, by comparison, freshly collected rain-water or snow would be pretty much the safest collectable water to drink having only airborn pollutants .. unless downwind of something particularly unpleasant .. unlikely in the context of wild camping.
I don't think the thread was really concerned with emergency use of water - just the treatment or non-treatment during normal outings.
I'm sure if I was (literally) dying of thirst, any source would be fair game - even water from Sheep Spring !
Cheers
Chris
Drinking untreated water is ok so long and you are 100% sure it is from the source and you have traced the route, snow rain water should be treated. In an emergancy, who cares water will keep you alive and you can worry about the bugs later.
Probably me, but I'm not sure I quite understand what you're saying ... it's difficult if not impossible to be 100% sure of the source - that's what makes the issue of whether to drink without treatment or not questionable.
I can't imagine any source of water not being fed essentially by rain or snow - and the longer it's collecting on the ground, the more likely it is to pick up organisms/minerals that could cause problems. I would have thought that, by comparison, freshly collected rain-water or snow would be pretty much the safest collectable water to drink having only airborn pollutants .. unless downwind of something particularly unpleasant .. unlikely in the context of wild camping.
I don't think the thread was really concerned with emergency use of water - just the treatment or non-treatment during normal outings.
I'm sure if I was (literally) dying of thirst, any source would be fair game - even water from Sheep Spring !
Cheers
Chris
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Bruxy - Posts: 114
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by tpage » Tue Sep 12, 2006 3:12 pm
Alan Murray wrote:On a trip to Ailsa Craig this summer we were warned not to drink from the stream as many Gannets fly over to the mainland & feed on the landfill sites & you could catch Botulism.
Hi Alan,
Sounds like an unusual warning. Gannets almost exclusively feed on fish and wouldnt be seen dead on a mainland landfill site. Maybe the person giving you this warning was getting gannets mixed up with the Black backed Gulls?
-tony
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by Douglas Wilcox » Tue Sep 12, 2006 8:20 pm
Yes I agree with Tony, I have never seen or heard of gannets foraging on tips. Mind you if you have ever seen gannet poo you would not drink out of that well on Ailsa Craig either.
When I was in the Scouts, I used to be called "steambiler" as I would drink out of nearly any moving water without ill effect. I survived this behaviour for about 25 years. Then one time, high up in Coir' a' Ghrunnda in the Skye Cuillin I got very thirsty. We were crossing from Coruisk to Glen Brittle via the Dubhs Ridge and it was a really hot sunny day at the end of March. Going down to the lochan on the sunny side I was parched, there was a little stream of snow melt and I drank a lot. My brother stuck to his cans of IrnBru. I was ill with bloody diarrhoea for about 3 weeks. He was fine.
Possible causes of this type of illness include these delightful little organisms that share the Earth with us:
Salmonella,
Shigella,
Campylobacter jejuni
Yersinia enterocolitica
E. coli
Entamoeba histolytica
Up there in the Cuillin there is no vegetation and no sheep. I have no doubt that it was a human jobby wot dun it. I now carry water or, at a real push, would boil water in a Kelly Kettle for several minutes.
In Scotland on Sundy at the weekend there was a front page article about the problems caused by the huge increase in wild camping in places like Loch Lomond and the Trossachs. The problem of human jobbies has now got so bad that small shops, tourist offices and park offices are to distribute free people bags which are like doggy bags but a bit bigger.
To keep your tummy safe, here are some fresh water taps in Lewis, Great Bernera, Harris, Berneray and N Uist:
Lewis:
Miavaig Jetty, NB090344
Breascleit Pier, NB208351
Carlabhaigh Pier, NB192422
Great Bernera
slipway, NB152400
Circiebost Pier, NB184360
Harris:
Tolmachan, NB096054
Berneray:
hostel NF932814
harbour NF922811
jetty NF915799
N Uist:
Lochmaddy pier NF920679
Douglas
When I was in the Scouts, I used to be called "steambiler" as I would drink out of nearly any moving water without ill effect. I survived this behaviour for about 25 years. Then one time, high up in Coir' a' Ghrunnda in the Skye Cuillin I got very thirsty. We were crossing from Coruisk to Glen Brittle via the Dubhs Ridge and it was a really hot sunny day at the end of March. Going down to the lochan on the sunny side I was parched, there was a little stream of snow melt and I drank a lot. My brother stuck to his cans of IrnBru. I was ill with bloody diarrhoea for about 3 weeks. He was fine.
Possible causes of this type of illness include these delightful little organisms that share the Earth with us:
Salmonella,
Shigella,
Campylobacter jejuni
Yersinia enterocolitica
E. coli
Entamoeba histolytica
Up there in the Cuillin there is no vegetation and no sheep. I have no doubt that it was a human jobby wot dun it. I now carry water or, at a real push, would boil water in a Kelly Kettle for several minutes.
In Scotland on Sundy at the weekend there was a front page article about the problems caused by the huge increase in wild camping in places like Loch Lomond and the Trossachs. The problem of human jobbies has now got so bad that small shops, tourist offices and park offices are to distribute free people bags which are like doggy bags but a bit bigger.
To keep your tummy safe, here are some fresh water taps in Lewis, Great Bernera, Harris, Berneray and N Uist:
Lewis:
Miavaig Jetty, NB090344
Breascleit Pier, NB208351
Carlabhaigh Pier, NB192422
Great Bernera
slipway, NB152400
Circiebost Pier, NB184360
Harris:
Tolmachan, NB096054
Berneray:
hostel NF932814
harbour NF922811
jetty NF915799
N Uist:
Lochmaddy pier NF920679
Douglas
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Douglas Wilcox - Posts: 2878
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by Slaphappy » Thu Sep 14, 2006 4:26 pm
Hi Chris,
It is not impossible (but perhaps inpracticle) to trace the source of water, just go up until you can go no higher, if you come across any form of life other than plant life think twice about drinking the water, really it is common sence mixed with knowledge of your environment and a bit of luck. I have drunk from wells in the sahara and rivers in africa with no purification and had no problems then drunk tap water in spain and been sick as a dog.
There are statistics in the natural filtration of water through organic matter but it has been some years since my survival courses and I don't remember them. I am sure if you dig around you will find answers.
Rain water can pick up polutants and contain algea that can cause stomach upsets, rare but been known, even if you are wild camping 200 miles from a power station you will still have the polutant in the water. Look at the dispersal or polutant from chernoboyl. Snow, god I would never drink any snow without boiling it first as you have no idea of source.
So in responce to the original, what do others do and are they gimmicks, well I travel light as possible for all expiditions I take a pre-mac but only use it depending on where I am and if I feel it appropriate for its use. Example: if I am kayaking and taking on water direct from river or streams by campsite then always always steralise (pre mac or boil/millbank). If I am in snow I will boil, apart from to stop hypothermia it was something a specialist in alpine survival said to do, so, without question I boil snow. Wild Camping uk or abroad, depending on where I am, signs of human or animal life, climate, general conditions visual checks of surroundings I will go with no purification.
When it comes to your health and ultimatly happiness and enjoyment of a trip it is simple, if in doubt go without or boil / purify etc.
I remember one statistic, not sure if still true, that only 12% of the worlds water is consumable without purification I think the areas of this were in Canada, Antartic, South Africa and some desert. So I guess purify everything.
Cheers
Jez
It is not impossible (but perhaps inpracticle) to trace the source of water, just go up until you can go no higher, if you come across any form of life other than plant life think twice about drinking the water, really it is common sence mixed with knowledge of your environment and a bit of luck. I have drunk from wells in the sahara and rivers in africa with no purification and had no problems then drunk tap water in spain and been sick as a dog.
There are statistics in the natural filtration of water through organic matter but it has been some years since my survival courses and I don't remember them. I am sure if you dig around you will find answers.
Rain water can pick up polutants and contain algea that can cause stomach upsets, rare but been known, even if you are wild camping 200 miles from a power station you will still have the polutant in the water. Look at the dispersal or polutant from chernoboyl. Snow, god I would never drink any snow without boiling it first as you have no idea of source.
So in responce to the original, what do others do and are they gimmicks, well I travel light as possible for all expiditions I take a pre-mac but only use it depending on where I am and if I feel it appropriate for its use. Example: if I am kayaking and taking on water direct from river or streams by campsite then always always steralise (pre mac or boil/millbank). If I am in snow I will boil, apart from to stop hypothermia it was something a specialist in alpine survival said to do, so, without question I boil snow. Wild Camping uk or abroad, depending on where I am, signs of human or animal life, climate, general conditions visual checks of surroundings I will go with no purification.
When it comes to your health and ultimatly happiness and enjoyment of a trip it is simple, if in doubt go without or boil / purify etc.
I remember one statistic, not sure if still true, that only 12% of the worlds water is consumable without purification I think the areas of this were in Canada, Antartic, South Africa and some desert. So I guess purify everything.
Cheers
Jez
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Slaphappy - Posts: 303
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by Owen » Thu Sep 14, 2006 5:08 pm
Slaphappy wrote:When it comes to your health and ultimatly happiness and enjoyment of a trip it is simple, if in doubt go without or boil / purify etc.
I remember one statistic, not sure if still true, that only 12% of the worlds water is consumable without purification I think the areas of this were in Canada, Antartic, South Africa and some desert. So I guess purify everything.
Cheers
Jez
Canada I belive has gardia in almost all of it's rivers and streams.
Bilharzia can be found throughout Africa - trust me you don't want to get these in your system - so I think your statistic is out of date. I'd sooner take water from a stream in the wilds of Scotland than one in Africa; and even then I'd boil it.
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by Slaphappy » Thu Sep 14, 2006 7:01 pm
Hi
Yeah we are talking 15 years ago, the more the climate warms up the more micro organisms fester.
Blimey never knew about that in Canada. It was only one place in South Africa an area called Limpopo but only in the area that borders Zimbabwa, I wouldnt drink there now, god knows what has been dumped there since.
Yeah we are talking 15 years ago, the more the climate warms up the more micro organisms fester.
Canada I belive has gardia in almost all of it's rivers and streams.
Bilharzia can be found throughout Africa
Blimey never knew about that in Canada. It was only one place in South Africa an area called Limpopo but only in the area that borders Zimbabwa, I wouldnt drink there now, god knows what has been dumped there since.
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Slaphappy - Posts: 303
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by Mark R » Thu Sep 14, 2006 8:12 pm
Owen wrote:Canada I belive has gardia in almost all of it's rivers and streams.
Oops, last month I spent the best part of a week freely drinking from this Canadian river...
No ill effects (yet) though...
Mark Rainsley
South West Sea Kayaking
South West Sea Kayaking
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by Bruxy » Thu Sep 14, 2006 10:14 pm
Hi again,
Thanks for contributing .... very interesting stuff .....
What I was saying was that sometimes the origin of something unpleasant doesn't always show itself up to the human eye in the water - for example, my putrefying sheep just upstream of an apparently clear spring but probably more significantly Douglas's experience in the Cuillins.
(Was tempted to say "Douglas's jobby" but that wouldn't have come out quite right ... oh dear )
Being unable to detect these microbes in untreated water, I'd say that luck played more a part than common sense if the criterion for whether to drink or not is based on finding anything obviously dead sticking out of the surface.
Blimey, I would have been very reluctant to drink any untreated water from Africa as I would imagine the scale of the place precludes even visual checking of river water and the sanitation habits of the locals may leave something to be desired; rivers presumably serving remote villages with drinking, bathing, laundry and waste disposal facilities.
I would imagine the risks you took drinking there would be considerably higher than wilderness Scotland - glad you didn't succumb to anything nasty.
The Spanish tap water probably had a high mineral content which upset you.
Hmmmm ... I would still reckon that the concentrations of air-bourne, water soluble toxins would be too low to cause any significant risk in the wilderness areas of the UK - nuclear and industrial disasters apart.
In nearly all the sources of information I've been able to find on the 'net, just about all suggest drinking FRESHLY collected rainwater is perfectly acceptable provided normal camp-craft hygiene is adhered to.
Snow seems fair game in much the same way - provided collected in a similarly diligent way and not dug from the ground near possible sites of contamination.
Completely agree here - if in doubt, treat the water .. I guess my idea when kicking the thread off was that the doubt aspect can be difficult to quantify and so it always exists for me, so despite "getting away with it" for years, the more I've read, the more I'll be boiling my water in future. That's just me,mind - and I guess it's a "risk assessment" kind of thing ... whether water quality in places like the Highlands presents any appreciable risk compared to the overall sea-kayaking/mountain walking experience.
Still...interesting to see what people think.
Cheers
Chris
Thanks for contributing .... very interesting stuff .....
Slaphappy wrote:It is not impossible (but perhaps inpracticle) to trace the source of water, just go up until you can go no higher, if you come across any form of life other than plant life think twice about drinking the water, really it is common sence mixed with knowledge of your environment and a bit of luck.
What I was saying was that sometimes the origin of something unpleasant doesn't always show itself up to the human eye in the water - for example, my putrefying sheep just upstream of an apparently clear spring but probably more significantly Douglas's experience in the Cuillins.
(Was tempted to say "Douglas's jobby" but that wouldn't have come out quite right ... oh dear )
Being unable to detect these microbes in untreated water, I'd say that luck played more a part than common sense if the criterion for whether to drink or not is based on finding anything obviously dead sticking out of the surface.
Slaphappy wrote:I have drunk from wells in the sahara and rivers in africa with no purification and had no problems then drunk tap water in spain and been sick as a dog.
Blimey, I would have been very reluctant to drink any untreated water from Africa as I would imagine the scale of the place precludes even visual checking of river water and the sanitation habits of the locals may leave something to be desired; rivers presumably serving remote villages with drinking, bathing, laundry and waste disposal facilities.
I would imagine the risks you took drinking there would be considerably higher than wilderness Scotland - glad you didn't succumb to anything nasty.
The Spanish tap water probably had a high mineral content which upset you.
Slaphappy wrote:Rain water can pick up polutants and contain algea that can cause stomach upsets, rare but been known, even if you are wild camping 200 miles from a power station you will still have the polutant in the water. Look at the dispersal or polutant from chernoboyl. Snow, god I would never drink any snow without boiling it first as you have no idea of source.
Hmmmm ... I would still reckon that the concentrations of air-bourne, water soluble toxins would be too low to cause any significant risk in the wilderness areas of the UK - nuclear and industrial disasters apart.
In nearly all the sources of information I've been able to find on the 'net, just about all suggest drinking FRESHLY collected rainwater is perfectly acceptable provided normal camp-craft hygiene is adhered to.
Slaphappy wrote:... If I am in snow I will boil, apart from to stop hypothermia it was something a specialist in alpine survival said to do, so, without question I boil snow. ...
Snow seems fair game in much the same way - provided collected in a similarly diligent way and not dug from the ground near possible sites of contamination.
Slaphappy wrote:When it comes to your health and ultimatly happiness and enjoyment of a trip it is simple, if in doubt go without or boil / purify etc.
I remember one statistic, not sure if still true, that only 12% of the worlds water is consumable without purification I think the areas of this were in Canada, Antartic, South Africa and some desert. So I guess purify everything.
Cheers
Jez
Completely agree here - if in doubt, treat the water .. I guess my idea when kicking the thread off was that the doubt aspect can be difficult to quantify and so it always exists for me, so despite "getting away with it" for years, the more I've read, the more I'll be boiling my water in future. That's just me,mind - and I guess it's a "risk assessment" kind of thing ... whether water quality in places like the Highlands presents any appreciable risk compared to the overall sea-kayaking/mountain walking experience.
Still...interesting to see what people think.
Cheers
Chris
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