Drysuits and She Wee(ing)

[Tastim]

My partner are shopping for drysuits.

Most have a horizontal relief zip that the manufacturers commonly state can be used by women with the aid of a She Wee device.

With the position of the zip well above crotch level I wonder what position one has to be in to actually use a She Wee. It doesn't immediately strike me or my partner as something that is easy to do.

Before we lay out a considerable amount of money are there any women paddlers out there that confirm the easy use of a She Wee with a horizontal relief zip.

Cheers

Tim

[maryinoxford]

I've heard that some people manage okay, but I can be devil's advocate, and say that it wouldn't work for me.

My first paddling suit was a semi-dry, with the usual relief zip. As I'm quite fat but not too tall, to get the body size I needed, the suit was rather long for me. This was useful in pulling it up or down, to get the zip in the right place. But after trying a few times in my own bathroom, I realised that I couldn't reliably get a secure enough position with the funnel, to avoid leaks. Maybe some women are more skillful than me, or maybe some don't mind dribbling a little urine into their thermals, but it wasn't for me.

I wanted a fully-dry suit, and at the time (4 years ago) the only better option for me was a suit with a drop-seat, and the only people making them were Kokatat, so I bought one. Double the price of most other drysuits, but I've been very happy with it. I don't need help with the zip (fortunately!) and it does the job of keeping me dry and letting me make comfort stops.

If I were buying now, I'd consider the Peak Creek suit with the through-the-legs zipper, as a viable alternative to the drop-seat. Also, for the dedicated user of funnels, Kokatat offer the option of a front zip in a lower position. It would be worth checking out other makes of drysuits to see if anybody else offers this.

Mary

[MYSSAK]

WRITTEN BY NATALIE from Michal's log in:

Is the dry suit and shee wee only to be used on shore or is it also during crossings?

I am not big fan of shee wee as the success in using it without accidents is 50% so far.

I have dry suit with relief zip. If I need to go during a stop on the shore, the position of the zip doesn't matter to me as I prefer to take stuff off in order of comfort. The only down side is, someone has to land with me to undo the back zip.
But the next dry suit I'm looking to get will have the women zip, so no need for help.

If I am in the boat there is so far only one way how I can do it. I kneel on the seat facing stern and then use the shee wee and bottle. This works providing the sea conditions are not too rough and someone is rafting with my boat.
I will ask for relief zip as low as possible to be added to my future drysuit.

I have yet to discover how to do it in rougher conditions or without the need of kneeling. I can't imagine how to do it with drop seat zip only. Yes I can do it between boats when they are rafted, but again not in any other conditions than smooth.
So if anyone else has any idea, please, share.
To be able to go comfortably at any time when needed proved to be an essential part of prolonged kayaking and affected well being of individuals and team.

[maryinoxford]

Natalie, I was only talking about stops on shore. Using the drop seat is quicker and less hassle than stripping out of the suit. I'd never even considered doing it in the kayak, and I don't do long trips. But if I thought I might need to, I might just resort to incontinence pads.

Mary

[MYSSAK]

NATALIE:
I was just describing my own experience regardless of what was written before.

I at the moment am reluctant to get my drysuit wet from inside and if no real need for it I use trousers and cag when there is prospect of not being able to stop for relief. As shee wee works easier with this combination.

[Grahamd]

If you are looking at a drop seat, I think Reed do one for their paddle suit now.

[janet brown]

I've used a she-wee for stops on river trips a few times. Guys: advised not to read further!!

The relief zip in my Typhoon suit is fairly well situated, however the she-wee seems rather short. I discovered that the plastic tubing taken off a WW throwline bag (removed as recommended on WWSR) is a perfect fit as an extension tube!
I store both together in a small drawstring bag in my drybag, then fit together when needed.
I found the main trick with the funnel is to get it between the labia and hold firmly in place. The time I just held it over pubic hair without parting properly, I did end up with damp thermals. Having a full wax would probably aid the situation, but I'm not prepared to go to those lengths!
I stand in a similar position to how men wee, with hips pushed forwards. You might find it's quite difficult to wee otherwise as pelvic floor muscles don't relax well unless squatting right down, and I can't seem to squat as that leaves the tube pointing upwards through the relief zip.

Janet

[seylan]

I've got a ladies Kokatat Drysuit with a relief zipper. It's the same as the men's one (i.e. not the drop seat) but a bit lower. I've used it without problems. Not with a she-wee I have another brand - It's called Whizz Freedom and I think and may be a bit more flexible than the she-wee. I've not had any problems with it. Given the choice I'd put the zipper a little lower than even the ladies fit but it's fine.

The other option is the drop seat but I didn't fancy that as I sometimes wear all in one fleeces and also because I want to be able to just walk a bit away, turn my back and get on with it and not keep other people waiting for me to faff with my drysuit or find a suitably out of the way spot.

Kokatat drysuits are expensive (I was lucky enough to get one second hand) but another option would be to buy a drysuit without a relief zipper and get one fitted exactly where you want it.

[andreadawn]

I have a men's Kokatat drysuit with relief zipper (it was cheap, in a sale). The zip is definitely positioned a bit high up but there is enough slack in the material to pull it down a bit. I still find it a bit fiddly to get my grandly named Female Urinary Device through my inner layers and into position. I haven't tried using it whilst afloat; only whilst ashore. I find leaning forward against a boulder or cliff face is helpful which effectively lowers the zip a bit more ensuring that my wee doesn't have to start its journey going uphill. Damp inner layers are pretty much guaranteed if it does. My Shewee type thing came with two tubes; a short one and a three foot long one; the latter apparently to enable me to write my name in the snow like the guys. Can't imagine why it needs to be three feet long!!!!!

I probably won't bother buying a suit with a relief zipper next time. I'm not usually on the water long enough for it to be a problem and when ashore it would probably be just as easy to take the suit off.

Andrea Collins

[tenboats1]

A completely different solution..................I have recently purchased a dry suit without a relief zip and for £25 I bought a relief zip from Reed and fitted my own. 100% successful.

Point is, I fitted mine in the conventional horizontal position, but it did cross my mind to go vertical. Doing so should solve the OP's shee wee problem.

The other benefit is that you have a much bigger choice of drysuits, as few do relief zips.

Even if you don't fancy doing the job yourself and pay someone to do it, it might still be cheaper depending on what suit you buy. Even if a little more, you would appreciate the expense at every call of nature !!

TB

[The Shiner]

I've used a she-wee for stops on river trips a few times. Guys: advised not to read further!!

The relief zip in my Typhoon suit is fairly well situated, however the she-wee seems rather short. I discovered that the plastic tubing taken off a WW throwline bag (removed as recommended on WWSR) is a perfect fit as an extension tube!
I store both together in a small drawstring bag in my drybag, then fit together when needed.
I found the main trick with the funnel is to get it between the labia and hold firmly in place. The time I just held it over pubic hair without parting properly, I did end up with damp thermals. Having a full wax would probably aid the situation, but I'm not prepared to go to those lengths!
I stand in a similar position to how men wee, with hips pushed forwards. You might find it's quite difficult to wee otherwise as pelvic floor muscles don't relax well unless squatting right down, and I can't seem to squat as that leaves the tube pointing upwards through the relief zip.

Janet

OH NO! I kept reading!
I really should learn to do as I'm told!

[TechnoEngineer]

I have a vague recollection about Freya using a different product. I think it was this:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=41543&hilit=freya&start=59

"I saw a small animal we call in Germany “Wiesel”, kind of a mixture between rat and cat – it came very curious just close to me while I was standing on a rock peeing – it obviously never has seen a woman peeing standing up! Well, thank goodness for my “Freshette” (www.freshette.com). This one works comfortable and safely, none of the other products on the market do (no, they didn’t sponsor me…)! Don’t try the soft rubber one (unsafe), or there is a long slim one (it hurts) or whatever! Through my male pee zipper I can use it even staying seated in my kayak. An essential skill as a single female kayaker paddling in a dry suit! I’m just hoping I’ll never slip off a rock with an open pee zipper – same bad luck as if a wave washes into your cockpit when you are doing the job in the kayak…"

[Tastim]

Thanks for all the replies, most illuminating.

Cheers

Tim

[moragjones]

There used to be a product called a Jill's John (I think) which was marketed at aviators. I think it contains some granules that turn the pee solid so maybe would be a bit safer, though probably a one-shot item. Never used one myself but it might be worth a go. Maybe available through gliding websites?

M

[John N]

So why are the zips horizontal in the first place - trouser flys aren't. Is it a manufacturing issue? Seems to me that a vertical zip of suitable length would take care of both ends for both genders. I don't (as yet) own a drysuit but I'd have thought that a long zip from the seat to the higher chest would provide access / egress to the suit and be easier to do up or undo by one's self. I've asked before, but I can't see why it's not possible to make a two piece combo with a reliable seal so that in event of wear a whole suit does not need to be replaced.

[truckturner]

You need to speak to this man and he will make you a suit DAM Watersports 01234267314