Signals

[Iain W]

What is a good signal for one at a time?

Previously I have used one hand in the air with an open palm. However I agree that it is completely counter intuitive and means stop in virtually ever other situation.

I was recommended a hand vertical (side on) in front of the face as one option but what other options are there?

Cheers

Iain

[clarky999]

One finger if you're close enough to distinquish it, one paddle blade up, or fist dipped once (dipping lots, like pulling a chain, means everyone come).

I've had confusion on a river using palm forward signals before - to me (and I think most people) arm forward palm out means halt (as in any non-boating situation), but someone confused that as send the next one down.

[DaveBland]

I use a very deliberate, repeat pattern of: one hand/finger up followed by a stop palm followed by one hand/finger up followed by a stop palm... at about 1 second intervals.

[Natalie]

If you follow the line of sight rule you could alway use the index finger in the air then point to where you want the person to go and repeat for each person.

Personally I think whatever signal you go for you should make sure there is movement involved so the only static signal used is the stop signal which helps to avoid confusion.

[Canoe_princess]

Don't think it matters as long as it is agreed amongst the group and can not be mistaken for anything else.

My group use a fist held up and then lowerd so your arm is at a right angle. This means one person go. If this action is repeated several times then it means 'everyone go' . We tend to avoid signals that involve fingers becase come 3.30pm in winter at a distance they are not clear. We don't use paddles to signal.

'Stop' is an arm held up... and the only other one we use is pointing to where you want people to go, or pointing at yourself to mirror the signals back to the signaler.

[Green.media]

I've always used a clenched fist with the middle finger extended for one down, if on steep stuff or behind a large rock a paddle held vertically in the air static is one down, much easier to have a signal for 1 down as you could simply repeat it as many times as needed, much more dangerous if a signal for 1 inly down gets confused with all down and you end up with 3 people going round in a munchy hole!
Just make sure what ever you use is agreed before you get on the water.
Cheers
Rich.

[freddie]

I point at a person, then point where they should go/eddy out. No need to complicate things.

[Simon Westgarth]

I point at a person, then point where they should go/eddy out. No need to complicate things.

That is the way to go, managing the descent specifically normally avoids much call for rescue.

[clarky999]

Plenty of scenarios where you are signalling from the bottom to a guy in an eddy at the top to send the next one of the group down, etc, though. If you can't see the group, you just need to tell him you're ready for the next, he can tell them where to go/etc. Or if there's no direct line of sight - eg top to bottom of Triple on the Nesk - sticking a blade up from the bottom is the only way to signal without having the faff of someone out their boat.

Not that it's a big deal or anything, but a simple signal for 'next one' is pretty useful.

[DaveBland]

Not a fan of whistle use at all on a river unless it's for signalling something bad.
But... if it's pre-arranged for that specific drop, a single clear blow is useful for 'next' when there's no line of sight.

[scottdog007]

I get the impression many people like the horizontal paddle signal for stop. So paddle held horizontal signifiying do not come, myself inculded I prefer the hand held infront low. I was on a river when eveyone was in an eddy and there was no room for anyone else. I knew we were close to a restriction a nasty restiction, and we had a a signal sent to us saying from someone a long way away, a hand signal to say stop, yet the person in front of me thought the signal was for one person to go down and was about to go, but I stopped them. They argued with me, but I insisted they get out immediately. We argued but I insisted they get out. I climbed out and helped them climb the bank with a throw bag. We were at the restriction of the Lion in Scotland and it was a 'killer'. Even now I don't think the guy knows how close he was 'ucking himself so I never got any thanks and probably will not get any.

[ChrisE]

Not a fan of whistle use at all on a river unless it's for signalling something bad.
But... if it's pre-arranged for that specific drop, a single clear blow is useful for 'next' when there's no line of sight.

I would tend to think I'd prefer one whistle blow for stop or alarm, and two for next one. (not that I like using whistle blows, or have used them). That way if you need to signal that there is an issue and that they have to stop and wait, or get out or something then you can, and you don't have the worry that they might not hear two whistle blows and then come down when they shouldn't.

[Gwynfor]

These (or a subset of them) seem to be standard with nearly everyone I have been boating with;

http://internationalrafting.com/wp-cont ... 010-V1.pdf

thanks

[David Foley]

Make sure everyone in the group knows what signals will be used, especially with groups you know very little of. Make them simple too.

[geyrfugl]

Half the battle is to ensure that the group know how you intend to run the rapid before anyone sets off down. And paddlers who have bought in to the idea of having someone else make the decisions. If you have clear signals to eddy out and give a quick briefing before running, then you should never need a stop signal, so any of the single arm or paddle up signals (as agreed in advance) should be clear. A longer briefing at the start of the trip should ensure that everyone knows what is involved in "we'll run this one at a time on my signal [passed back by X who will paddle down to an eddy partway]".

On our trips with beginners we try to agree that "no signal means stop" (both interpretations of that are valid) and no-one moves until a clear go signal is given, whatever that may be. Yes, occasionally this does result in no-one moving because we didn't manage clear enough line-of-sight, but that's usually a safe and fixable situation unless it's going to get dark or the river is coming up fast and you're nowhere near an escape. For poor line of sight, a single paddle blade held vertically higher than could possibly occur in the course of just paddling down is usually pretty distinctive. You may choose to agree that oscillating the vertical paddle up and down is equivalent to the usual flushing "all pile down" signal. The time when this goes wrong is if you are trying to give signals whilst still needing both hands on the paddle and the paddle to stay put in your eddy, but then no signal is going work in that situation, so don't let it arise ! Avoid dark green paddles with wooded banks ... indeed high visibility paddles and arms do make for clearer signalling everywhere.

As long as you have agreed on what's happening in advance the same signals work for running rapids in pairs where one person is following the line set by another.

These (or a subset of them) seem to be standard with nearly everyone I have been boating with;

A subset, maybe... that's a huge number of signals, which may work for communication between raft guides, but is too much to hope your novice paddlers will remember. A lot of them need both hands free. One, in particular (on page 10) is the rafty signal for "I'm OK", which is basically the same as the kayak/canoeist signal for "come to me", which, if you are in a position to need to say that you have survived, is probably not the best signal to give... It is a useful signal, but make sure your group know how it is to be used !

Andy

[mattdennies]

I use arm raised up and one finger pointing to the sky then either tap on your head for come to me or point to where you want them. I only use one at a time or all down to avoid confusion trying to count how many fingers are being held up. I dont think there's that many situations where you want two or three people at a time anyway.

I don't use paddle signals as if someone is taking a beating in a hole or fighting to stay in an eddy that surges up and down it can easily look like you're raising your paddle for the next person.

[fluid combinations]

Lets all remember one main thing

keep it simple stupid!!!

River signals need to be kept simple to avoid confusion within the group you are paddling with. As a rule of thumb I try to keep a minimum on the number of signals I use to no more than five these are:

eddy: pointing finger in the air and moving in a circular motion.

go to: pointing in a direction to where you want a paddler to go

come to me: taping myself on my head palm down

stop: one hand in the air palm fancing towards the paddler

1 paddler: one finger in the air with the rest clenchedin a fist


I tend not to use all these signals I generally use come to me, go to and stop on the mojority of rivers. With a good briefing at the start before paddling down a harder stretch of water we can clarify what stratagy we intend to use ie eddy hopping, one at a time so the use of signals can be almost be put down to one or two.

I hope this is helpful but this is just my thoughts on it!!!

[Tea Boy Tom]

I wholeheartedly agree with the 'keep it simple' premise. I also believe that visual signals should be based around what you'd intuitively use anyway. I have to say, I don't really have a distinct 'one at a time' signal. I just have a thumbs up for go. The reason being, if one of the team is performing 'traffic control' duties, people will wait for their signal anyway. If line of sight is clear down the rapid, once a go signal is given, the individual team members can normally judge when it's appropriate to head on down, judging spacing and so on. If they lack the experience to make that judgement, I can ask them to wait individually for a thumbs up. I feel this approach keeps things lean and simple.

[lennart]

if all down is moving a first up and down with an betn elbow ,
then I think that movement doing only once is an easy option.

unfortunatly there are no many different signals of this world.

[Tom_Laws]

I wholeheartedly agree with the 'keep it simple' premise. I also believe that visual signals should be based around what you'd intuitively use anyway.

Were you on the Lledr the day Timmy stood up, held up his deck and waved an imaginerly wang about? "Piece of piss" was the signal.....

As for keeping it simple - for me, Lee Royle is on the money "You" "Go there". As such, a good idea to always point at the way, and never the mank.

If you paddle as a tight group then you tend to know what each other mean anyway, and the facial expression normally says more.

[scottdog007]

One other thing. Don't point at a 'nasty' you should always point the hand to the direction you want someone to take. So for example if you are down stream and made an eddy and you can see there is a tree in the river but the rest of the team up stream can not see it, then as you call them down and they get near to you, you wave the direction or position you want them to go, waving frantically means move quickly.

Sounds obvious but I heard a story of a top level foreign paddler pointing at a stainer and the British team all all ended up aiming for it and as soon as they realised the mistake had to take frantic action.

[DaveBland]

Sounds obvious but I heard a story of a top level foreign paddler pointing at a stainer and the British team all all ended up aiming for it...

Yeah, well we all know Jonny Foreigners do everything backwards. Can't understand a word they say, half the time – and they eat funny food.

[Tom_Laws]

I heard a tale of a dude mis-interpreting the swirling of an arm, followed by a point (Eddy out, over there) as "round 'em up, and ship 'em out". He lead his group of freshers into some gnar.

[jmmoxon]

US paddlers (almost) all use the tap on the head as an okay signal.

Mike

[Tom_Laws]

US paddlers (almost) all use the tap on the head as an okay signal.

Mike

As do divers (on the surface) and rafters. And me.

[RichTyler]

no signal no go
hand raised for one person
fist pump for everyone
very simple :)

works for me, main point is establishing whole group is using the same system from the start of the session

[morsey]

US paddlers (almost) all use the tap on the head as an okay signal.

If you use both hands, it is internationally recognised as meaning the Americans are behind and could do with going a bit faster.