Which C1 paddle

[andrew549]

Hi I'm looking at getting a paddle in the near future and not sure what to get, it would mainly be used for whitewater with possibly some playboating as well. Looking at spending up to £150 possibly more but not too much more.

Andy

[davebrads]

You're limited for choice when buying a whitewater C1 paddle

For me it would be the VE. It has a good feel, slices quite nicely, and is both light and very strong.

An alternative is a Mitchell- I prefer the Luxor.

I've had a glass Werner Bandit but it didn't last two minutes so I won't recommend one to anybody. It wasn't even very nice to paddle with either. The carbon might be better, though very expensive and you'll probably have to order it in from the States. I've also tried a Lettmann for slalom racing on the basis that their kayak paddles are bombproof, but it was a big let down, being both very expensive and short-lived.

If you really want to splash out then the Mitchell Wood/Carbon paddle is a beauty, but it probably doesn't take the punishment that the VE or Mitchell do. This is made by the US branch of the Mitchell family, not the Chester company, though the paddles are listed on the Brookbank web site.

[andrew549]

Thanks the main one I had been looking at was the VE paddle but I hadn't seen or heard anything about the C1 version, another one I've seen was the streamlyte C1 but I cant find any information about it. Thanks thats made my choice a bit easier.

[TheKrikkitWars]

Big question: What are you intending to paddle on what? Whitewater canoe paddles come in several distinct shapes and what boat and water you plan to paddle affects what I'd choose.

I have to disagree most vehemently with Dave on the glass Werner Bandits, I've had the same one for six years now, and it's still going strong (albeit with significant wear to one corner of the blade [Largely from the first two years of it's life in which I was paddling HPP at least three times a week, and constantly punted off the sides]); For me the bandit remains my go-to paddle and I'd replace it with another in a shot when the time comes. I wouldn't buy a carbon one though, much better to get a VE than go through the effort of trying to source a Carbon Bandit in the UK.

I also have a Mitchell Paddles Premier (wood-carbon) and it's actually an awful lot tougher than you might expect, having taken on a lot of steep shallow rivers with little more than scratches to show for it, in spite of some serious hits (which I was convinced had damaged it at the time); Crucially for me, it's warmer to paddle with in cold weather and the gentle flex means less shoulder and back pain than using my Carbon or Glass paddles; Most people who own them warn that they do need to be reconditioned evry so often as the aluminum tips tend to start to delaminate from the main paddle, with people saying they've sent their paddle back to mitchell for a repair every 5 years, and owned the paddle for 15+ years, I think that's actually a pretty unmatchable a repuation for reliablity really (given that even the tougest composite paddles tend to be disposable and have a finite life span).

Another tempting paddle (and perhaps my next paddle buy) is a Endless River Phantom, I've used them in the past and they're tough, powerful and suprisingly cheap... the real draw for me is how much power you can get with one even in shallow water (which is in fact where I feel my bandit out-performs my premier, being a shorter blade, you can get maximum power with less risk of catching the blade on a submerged obsticle.)

[andrew549]

I'm planning on paddling rivers but not sure quite what and in a variety of boats from C1 river runners to the esquif zoom, as well as a bit of playboating for when I cant get on the rivers.

[girly paddler]

An Endlss River Phantom is heavy, indestructible and lacking in precision. I have no doubt that mine will be around following a thermonuclear war. I dislike mine so much that I have been determined to break it. Maybe if I had frogs on it I would change my mind. At least then I wouldn't lose it amongst the rest of my black kit.

You cannot go wrong with the Mitchel Luxor. Lovely paddles and not much more expensive than the Phantom if you shop around and get a good deal.

My experience of the Werners is that they break, although Werner replaced mine. I do not want another. Borrow some paddles but if you borrow a Mitchel you will never want to give it back.

[Sickboy]

I bought a VE C1 paddle a while back, great blade, plenty of grip as it should for its size and superbly lite. The T grip is pretty large, fine for my big hands but not every one who has tried it loved it as much.
Same its too short now I've changed boats, it was fine in a fly Grrr.

[KelvinH]

I'll chip in as I have paddled with most of the paddles in question for a reasonable period of time.

Here's my view,

Werner Bandit. (Glass) Great value, strong and light. A couple of friends of mine use the carbon and it's bomber.
Mitchell wood/carbon. Great feel and slice, stiffer in the shaft than most would think. Super strong, if you are hard on your paddles this is most likely the best value! A little narrow in the end of the blade for shallow rivers/slides.
Phantom. Sloppy, slushy... sorry Dave!
I now paddle with a Kober Athens and to be honest nothing mentioned above gets even close to it!

Kelvin.

[davebrads]

Where did you get your Kober from? I haven't used one myself but it looks good. I tried to source one when I ended up with the Lettmann but couldn't find anybody importing them.

[KelvinH]

Hi Dave,

I get my Kober paddles through www.bushpaddler.de

Athens standard 250 Euro
Athens re-enforced 280 Euro
Around 20 Euro shipping

The Athens has been replaced with the Rocket, this blade has a lot of foam in the core and a very thin edge. Not as durable as the Athens. Flo at Bushpaddler is one of the few retailers still stocking the Athens as Kober now only do them as a special if larger orders are placed.

Hope this helps,

Kelvin.

[TheKrikkitWars]

I bought a VE C1 paddle a while back, great blade, plenty of grip as it should for its size and superbly lite. The T grip is pretty large, fine for my big hands but not every one who has tried it loved it as much.
Same its too short now I've changed boats, it was fine in a fly Grrr.

You could take the t-grip off and add a wooden dowel to extend the shaft and put the t-grip back on top of that?

[Adrian Cooper]

An Endlss River Phantom ............. Maybe if I had frogs on it I would change my mind.

A few years back Dave used to do paddles with frogs and fishes on, very smart. Back then these were £60 and the Phantom was £80. The froggy paddles were kevlar and very tough but were discontinued. I like mine since it was really durable, I could drag a boat across a rock slide with it without fear of breakage. I never trusted my Bandit to do this. Since then I have bought a Nantahala which is not as nice as many mentioned here but quite suitable for trad boating and very tough. Since then the price of the Phantom seems to have escalated enormously.

[davebrads]

The froggy paddles were kevlar

I don't really get why kevlar isn't used more in the construction of paddles. The resulting blade is a little heavy, and there may be a bit more flex but not noticeable so, unlike some glass blades. The disadvantage of carbon is it is prone to catastrophic failure. Freeblades used to do a blade made from carbon kevlar weave which used to last for years and combined the best aspects of the two materials. Galasport stll do - I have just had a look on the Cool Blue Canoes web site, and they are listing a white water blade in carbon kevlar, might be worth a look?

Cool Blue Canoes have long been importing Galasport slalom boats and gear, but now it looks as if they are bringing in a range of whitewater equipment, and they say that Brookbank London are stocking the paddles.

[andrew549]

OK which is the 1 paddle you would recommend for use on rivers and playing on waves.

[TheKrikkitWars]

I'd reccomend the werner bandit, yes it will wear and chip at the edges, yes it will look ugly in time, and yes you'll look like everyone else but it's cheap, tough and (in my experience) extremely reliable

[Sickboy]

I bought a VE C1 paddle a while back, great blade, plenty of grip as it should for its size and superbly lite. The T grip is pretty large, fine for my big hands but not every one who has tried it loved it as much.
Same its too short now I've changed boats, it was fine in a fly Grrr.

You could take the t-grip off and add a wooden dowel to extend the shaft and put the t-grip back on top of that?

If only it was that simple, tapered shaft you see......
Probably gunna have to bite the bullet and cough up the £100 for a re-shaft, can't have it sitting about gathering dust..

[davebrads]

Josh and I disagree wholeheartedly on this one - I hate the Bandit, not only because mine let me down, but also because it isn't a very nice paddle in the first place.

The VE is the same price, is made from Carbon, much nicer to paddle with, won't wear to the same degree, and as far as I know, nobody has broken one yet, apart from a shaft on one of the early production paddles. And the guys using the VE are pretty hard on their paddles.

So for my money, it is the VE.

[wetnobby]

I have been using a Profiplast C1 paddle for around 12 months now and its awesome....
Wooden T grip, tapered Carbon shaft with a plastic sleeve around the lower shaft to protect from rocks and pry's, a Carbon reinforced nylon blade, looks a little strange, paddles better than any I have ever tried and what's more everyone who has ever tried it is pretty much of the same opinion!!
Its spent all its life scraping off rocks and shows no signs of wear at all....
The downside, I only have 1 of them and its great for play boating but a little short for OC1...kind of reminds me I really should look at getting another longer one

Chris

[michielv]

@Sickboy: regarding the plan to extend the current shaft of your paddle, especially a wooden dowel is perfect to make it fit a tapered shaft, although you might have to insert it from the blade end (i.e. remove the blade too).

It shouldn't be too hard to extend the shaft om the topside, it will take some time to sand/rasp/file the wooden dowel to a perfect fit (probably a lot less time than earning 100 quid costs ;-) ).

[Adrian Cooper]

Chris, do you have a web link to those paddles? I checked the Profiplast website and couldn't find anything of that quality.

[wetnobby]

I will see what I can find...bear with me

Chris

[wetnobby]

Sorry for the wait!
Seems there has been a parting of the ways or re structuring in the business and the paddles are still carrying the same logo as used previously but now marketed as Panenka paddles.
Don't let the name put you off, if you find the right ones they are great!

Web site is here..
http://www.panenka-paddles.cz/o-nas

Chris

[Adrian Cooper]

Thanks Chris, they do look nice.

[wild river]

Not used all of the above, but had a mitchell premier for 10 years and still love it. Replaced the alumiium tip once and it lasted really well to all the abuse I gave it.
Left on the side of the road for 15 minutes so now "owned" by someone else. Gutted
Sean

[elveys]

Anyone know much about the Robson Quantum?

I'm looking for a new WW paddle but don't want spoon blade? Choice seems even more limited.

http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.robsonpaddle.com/robsonpaddle/site08/paddle.php%3Fid%3D72%26char%3Dstech&ei=qx7nTs_4M8b-4QTC8s3UCA&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CEQQ7gEwBQ&prev=/search%3Fq%3Drobson%2Bquantum%2Bpaddle%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1R2DKUK_en-GBGB418%26biw%3D1024%26bih%3D667%26prmd%3Dimvns

[TheKrikkitWars]

Thw Quantum is spooned... It doesn't have the rib on the back so characteristic of spoonbladed paddles because it's a slalom blade, thus needs to move through the water like a hot knife through butter.

[wetnobby]

Spoon or curved?
They are two very different things.

[elveys]

Spoon or curved?
They are two very different things.

Can you explain the difference please? I tried a bandit but didn't like the blade which I'd have described a curved but looking at the paddle write up it's says it's spooned!

I have a Nantahala at the moment which is too short so looking to replace and thinking there must be some better options. Usage will be in G2-3 in trad boats and a Caption fitted out solo with kneeling thwart.

Is the VE blade the same as the Bandit?

[andrew549]

How to people glue the T grip into the shaft as I have a carbon shaft with a wooden T grip I was recommended to use hot melt glue so it can be easily shorted if needed, but the T grip doesn't fit in the shaft easily and looks like it would need a bit of sanding, is it best to sand the T grip or the inside of the shaft.

[Chris Bolton]

is it best to sand the T grip or the inside of the shaft

I would sand the T grip; easier, nicer dust (probably) and less loss of strength. Something to watch for; do not push the trip into the shaft and use the rim of the shaft to trim the T grip, you can easily split the shaft. If you're using hot melt (which is fine), you will need to sand the T grip to a loose fit so that there's a gap for the glue.

Chris